Organisational Badges Deutsche Volksgemeinschaft Westmark (Lothringen) member pin

[Avitas]

Hello all,

Inspired by Don's idea for an enamel membership pin/badge database here is my D.V.G. Westmark (Deutsche Volksgemeinschaft) member pin made by W. Redo, Saarlautern. These pins were worn by members of teh "German Community" in the Saar region of France. The pin has been glued together, but other than that it is in fine shape. Please leave your opinions on this one and post yours as well!

Cheers,

Pat

 

 

[Avitas]

and the reverse of this W.Redo DVG Westmark pin. Any opinions are great and be sure to post your examples.

Cheers,

Pat

 

 

[Scowen]

Nice looking badge you have there Pat.

This is one of those badges that is highly controversial as many enamel collectors believe that only this version shown above is original, & that any other style of reverse markings are copies......

I'd be interested in what our fellow members views are on this subject, but please, let's keep it civil. The last discussion I remember about them got quite heated .

Cheers

Don

[BURGERHAUS]

[attachmentid=53814][attachmentid=53815]

Gents Here is my example. If memory serves, Does Cone not state that Redo continued to produce these after the war? Combineed with the M9 controversy and the fact that just recently I saw a box of these for sale makes me very uncomfortable with this badge. I guess with this badge in particular one needs to try to feel comfortable with what they have. I wonder if we will ever learn more information about these. My hope is that one day some new information will shed some new light. I place mine in the "awaiting furthur details" box. Have a nice weekend. Robert

 

[--dj--Joe]

Have had this example since the early 60's. for what little that is worth.

The reverse font is more elongated than the two above.

It shows more wear than the scanner is displaying.

[attachmentid=53817][attachmentid=53818]

Comments welcome.

--dj--Joe

 

 

 

 

[BURGERHAUS]

DJ Joe Well now we have 3 diferent badges all with what appear to be diferent characteristics. Although Cone's examples do not feature high lettering like your example I would say that if the 3 pieces were sitting next to each other for sale at a table at a show I would probably try to acquire your example because it shows what looks to me like honest wear both front and rear. The fact that you have had it for a long time would mean to me that it never was artificially aged. It was worn a bit and then probably hidden or bounced around in a box for 15-20 years. I hope more examples will be shown. Surely other members have this badge in their collections. Robert

[Scowen]

I haven't one yet as I've never been sure of which type is correct.

However what I do notice from both Joe's & Robert's (the angle is wrong on Pat's to see clearly) is that the pin plate is the same type, very slightly oval. Perhaps this could show that at the very least they came from the same source even if the fonts are different.

Cheers

Don

[Avitas]

From what I have gathered on the other forum, there are a very small number of the "elongated" type writing style that are period original. I think this is the style that was still made post-war by the same maker, but I could be wrong. Sorry about the reverse scan on mine being on an angle, but I didn't want to chance re-breaking the pin on the reverse by putting pressure on it from the scanner lid. I can probably make another attempt if you guys want, but my pin connector plate is the same as the Joe's and Robert's. This leads to the conclusion that they were all made by W.REDO and not copies, but when each one was made is the dilemma I think Robert's is most likely period and Joe's is probably period judging by the wear on it and how long he has had it, making it one of the few examples of that type of printing that was period. I hope more light can be shed on this interesting pin.

Cheers,

Pat

[JNoble]

Here's my long W example to add to the mix as you can see it also has an oval attach plate.

 

[Scowen]

Thanks for posting it Jamie. I find the use of the oval plate on all these very interesting.... I'm also noticing the difference in the pebbling used in the Swastika, could be useful......

Cheers

Don

[BURGERHAUS]

Yes, the pebbling is diferent with each piece. Now if a brave soul will show his M9 example we can really scratch our heads.

[jray2986]

What about this one ,, a M9

 

[jray2986]

and the back

 

[Scowen]

Welcome to the forum jray2986.......

Ahhh the good ol' M9..... As you may already know, this is a controversial item disputed amongst collectors, you either like them or you don't.

In case you aren't aware of the reasons & for any other who are interested, there are two. The "M9" prefix was reserved solely for "Tages- und Festabzeichen" - Day and Meeting badges, known as "Tinnies". The DVG badge is a membership or sympathizer badge, not for a specific day or celebration, so that would indicate that it should not have an RZM mark or code number on it.

However there are also examples of late war standard NSDAP Party badges which also have this M9/312 mark. This could suggest that the maker was just confused over what markings to use.

So we'll keep it here as an example until more evidence turns up.

Thanks for posting

Don

[Scowen]

Picked up some of these the other week, all slightly different. First one fairly close to Robert's on the maker mark, but the pebbling looks a little different.

 

[Scowen]

Second. Tall thin letters on maker mark like James' but pebbling far more haphazard (couldn't get it lighter to see easier I'm afraid).

 

[Scowen]

Third. Tall think letters on the maker mark again, but pebbling a lot more regimented. Still a different die to James' as can be seen by the pebbles in the top arm of the Swaz......

This one is very tired & dark, I've lightened it considerably to show markings.

 

[BURGERHAUS]

Nice to see this thread come alive again. I have noticed also on Don's last example that the W in Westmark is slightly diferent than all the others. Would anyone know if Redo is still in business today? Don Thanks for showing and joining the DVG club. Robert

[Avitas]

Picked up some of these the other week, all slightly different. First one fairly close to Robert's on the maker mark, but the pebbling looks a little different.

Don's first example (post #15) is very similar to my example in posts 1 and 2. The pebbling in each are very orderly and the examples seem pretty similar. The maker mark and pin are almost a perfect match as well. Apparently there is some discussion about the elongated makers mark version and the M9 versions, is there anything to know about Don's and mine examples? I assume these examples are known to be legit (as far as we know), as far as I've gathered. Any comments on the similarities?

Cheers,

Pat

[Rosenberg]

Gentlemen,

while I have no example myself since I am totally uncertain which is good or not,I do have wondered whether anybody knows a bit more about the organisation itself? Were these pins only issued after 1936 as that is the time the place Saarlautern became Saarlautern?

[Scowen]

Very little seems to be known about either the organisation or the badges. What little is known is generlly taken from Cone's book "One People, One Reich", however it's now agreed that the book is not accurate in all areas. A good example is the Heims Ins Reich badge which he describes as a sympathisers badge, when in fact it's the membership badge of the Luxembourg fascist party "Volksdeutsche Bewegung" (VDB).

He also states that no postwar examples have been found with the name Saarlautern on them, which may have been correct at the time, but certainly isn't now (see below). It's certainly a badge/organisation that needs further study, but where to begin? Possibly the German archives?

Here is a fake Saarlautern badge, the pin plate gives it away, however with aging & the correct style plate someone purly using Cone's guide could possibly be taken in. I can't tell from the image whether the lettering is raised or not.....

The obverse. The enamelling looks poor & the pebbling indistict, but this could be the lighting. If the seller of this pin wasn't convinced it was original & hadn't refused to drop his price I would have picked it up for closer study.....

 

 

[--dj--Joe]

Interesting thread. Don, I appreciate being made aware of the fake example.

Have read that Werner Redo was destroyed near the end of the war but have seen no collaborating proof.

--dj--Joe

[Gew44]

This is my pin.

Is good ??

Thanks for reply

Regards

[Scowen]

From these pictures I'd say that it looks OK.

Cheers

Don

[JNoble]

How about this one.