Generalleutnant Roderich von Schoeler

[Komtur]

I got this bar a year ago. The auctioneer told me after the auction it belongs to Generalleutnant Roderich von Schoeler (he said it was given to him by the granddaughter of Schoeler). I?m always suspicious to such oral information, especially when there is no possibility to contact the informant.

I?ve got a lot of details about his career and his decorations before 1914 (e.g. by ranklists, Stammliste des 2. Garde-Regiments zu Fu?, an article about Schoeler in "Die Ritter des Ordens pour le m?rite" by M?ller-Witten").

The single decorations of the bar are:

Eisernes Kreuz, 2. Klasse 1914 (OEK 1909)

Offiziersdienstauszeichnung f?r 25 Jahre (OEK 1970/1)

Chinadenkm?nze f?r Nichtkombattanten Silber (OEK 3151)

Zentenarmedaille (1965/1)

Mecklenburg-Schwerin, Kriegsverdienstkreuz 2. Klasse 1914 (OEK 1352)

Braunschweig, Kriegsverdienstkreuz 2. Klasse 1914 (OEK 634)

Sachsen-Meiningen, Ehrenzeichen f?r Verdienst im Kriege (OEK 2717)

Schaumburg-Lippe, Kreuz f?r treue Dienste 1914 (OEK 1256)

Lippe-Detmold, Kriegsverdienstkreuz 1914 (OEK 1190)

Bremen, Hanseatenkreuz (OEK 651)

L?beck, Hanseatenkreuz (OEK 1265)

T?rkei, goldene Liakatmedaille mit Schwertern

1.) Is there evidence by any roll of these decorations, that Schoeler got them?

2.) Wich other orders he got in WWI (except the pour le m?rite and the 2.class of the REO with swords and oak leaf documented in the "Milit?r-Wochenblatt" by Geile)

3.) Can someone show a better pic of Schoeler (especially with his bar )

Greetings, Komtur.

Edited June 21, 2007 by Komtur

[Komtur]

...

[Komtur]

Generalleutnant Roderich Felix August von Schoeler (1862-1935)

02.08.14-30.04.16 Generalintendant des Feldheeres bei der OHL

01.05.16-03.10.16 Kommandeur der 20.Infanteriedivision

03.10.16-12.12.16 stv. preu?ischer Kriegsminister

12.12.16-11.05.17 Kommandeur der 11.Infanteriedivision

11.05.17-11.11.18 Kom. General des VIII.Armeekorps

30.6.1918 PLM

Rangliste 1887

Seconde-Lieutnant v. Sch?ler, 4. Garde-Regiment zu Fu?, kommandiert zur Dienstleistung zur Gewehr- und Munitions-Fabrik in Spandau

Rangliste 1904

Major v. Sch?ler, Versorgungs- und Justiz-Departement, 2. Versorgungsabteilung, RAO 4. Klasse, KO 3. Klasse

Ordensalmanach 1908/9

Oberstleutnant, Kommandeur des Landwehrbezirks III, Berlin W., Eisenacherstr. 113, geboren Trier 3.8.1862, Mecklenburg Greifenorden Ehrenkreuz, Preu?en RAO 4. Klasse, KO 3. Klasse, Dienstauszeichnungskreuz, Zentenarmedaille.

Rangliste 6.5.1913

Generalmajor, Kommandeur 1. Garde-Infanterie-Brigade, RAO 3. Klasse mit Schleife, KO 2. Klasse, Johanniterorden Ehrenritter, Dienstauszeichnungskreuz, F?rstlich Hohenzollernsches Ehrenkomturkreuz

Ehrenrangliste 1914 (1926)

1914 Generalmajor, Direktor des Armee-Verwaltungs-Departements und stellvertretender Bevollm?chtigter zum Bundesrat des deutschen Reiches. Im Kriege zuletzt F?hrer des VIII. Armeekorps, Generalleutnant a.D.

Geile Ordensverleihungen im Milit?r-Wochenblatt

RAO 2. Klasse mit Schwertern und Eichenlaub am 10.2. 1916 an Generalmajor von Sch?ler

Kommandeur Gruppenkommando 2 der Reichswehr

7.8.1919-30.9.1920 General der Infanterie Roderich von Schoeler

Edited June 21, 2007 by Komtur

[Paul C]

The SMK, DA and Centennial are confirmed. It is interesting that the China medal NK is not list in his DOA entry. The other awards are hard to confirm.

[Komtur]

The SMK, DA and Centennial are confirmed. It is interesting that the China medal NK is not list in his DOA entry. The other awards are hard to confirm.

Thanks Paul!

Means "SMK" the "Sachsen-Meiningen Ehrenzeichen f?r Verdienst im Kriege" ? Where is that confirmed?

The China medal NK not listed in his DOA entry is odd. But as he was 1899-1905 in the Kriegsministerium it is a possible award to him.

Stammliste des 2. Garde-Regiments zu Fu?:

Edited June 21, 2007 by Komtur

[Guest Rick Research]

I have transcribed the complete roll for the SMK, which will be published with the combined 1914-18 Saxe-Ernestine rolls (I did Sachsen-Coburg and Sachsen-Meiningen-- we will add in Erhard Roth's Sachsen-Al;tenburg) with other awards from the Thuringian duchies.

If you want I can make you a copy of his actual SMK roll entry.

Generalleutnant Roderich von Schoeller, ferner kommandierender General VIII. Armeekorps 30.5.17.

The page reference number is 52-B (so I can find it again).

[Komtur]

If you want I can make you a copy of his actual SMK roll entry.

Generalleutnant Roderich von Schoeller, ferner kommandierender General VIII. Armeekorps 30.5.17.

The page reference number is 52-B (so I can find it again).

it would be nice, if I could get a copy

[Guest Rick Research]

Here you go-- 4th from the bottom on page 52 of the second roll volume:

and he was "aus Trier."

By coincidence, see the ONLY noncombatant SMK awarded to a woman--Fr?ulein Anna Prehn-- 7th from the top.

[Daniel Krause]

Hi,

niiice bar!!!!

I cannot 100% confirm that is IS Schoelers bar, but I have a good feeling.

Problem is, there are no other ways to confirm it tham by a portrait with THIS bar in wear.

All his known WW1 awards were around the neck:

RAO 2nd class with Oakleaves, star and swords

Princely Hohenzollern, Honorary Commanders Cross with swords

Bavarian Military Merit Order 2nd class with swords

Saxon Albert commander with star and swords

W?rttemberg Frederick Commader with star and swords

Baden Z?hringer L?we commander with star and swords

Best regards

Daniel

[Komtur]

Thanks Rick and Daniel for the good news

The same person, "the granddaughter" of Schoeler, gave the following to the auction (and nothing more):

the above shown bar,

a pour le m?rite,

a star REO 2nd class with Oakleaves and swords,

a box of a Princely Hohenzollern Honorary Commanders Cross with swords,

a Bavarian Military Merit Order 2nd class with swords,

a W?rttemberg Frederick Commader with star and swords,

and two EK1 WW1

that fits to the information of Daniel , please tell me, what is your source ?

with regards, Komtur.

[Daniel Krause]

My source?

most of them are in the already published rolls (BMV, SA, BZ)

HEK and WF are in the soon published rolls done by Rick, Uwe and me.

Otherwise I collect info about German Generals since a lot of years.

Beste Gr??e aus Potsdam

Daniel

[Guest Rick Research]

Schoeler's HE2aX was 12th on the roll, 3 April 1916 as Generalmajor, General-Intendant des Feldheeres.

The Hohenzollern wartime rolls are mostly typed on enormous paper, so nothing exciting to look at... but do cover 1914-18 awards up to (the late ones are handwritten) ... 1947 !!!

[Komtur]

Thanks to a member of the German Forum SDA another decoration of the bar is confirmed by a roll :

Hanseatenkreuz L?beck an von Schoeler, Generalintendant des Feldheeres am 18.12.1915

[Guest Rick Research]

Is that the way the L?beck "roll" exists-- as an alphabetical list, written after all awards had been made? Or is that the index to it?

And is whoever has it WORKING ON IT TO PUBLISH IT? These rolls take much too much time and effort to "waste" if somebody else is duplicating the time and effort ALREADY.

[Komtur]

Is that the way the L?beck "roll" exists-- as an alphabetical list, written after all awards had been made? Or is that the index to it?

And is whoever has it WORKING ON IT TO PUBLISH IT? These rolls take much too much time and effort to "waste" if somebody else is duplicating the time and effort ALREADY.

Sorry Rick, I can?t answer your question , but I?ll give you a personel message who possibly can.

Greetings, Komtur.