Heer Herr Artillery Badge, Real or Not?

[sftrooper86]

Gentlemen,

Thank you again for all your help. Please give me your opinions if it is good or not.

My best,

Vince

[Paul R]

Hi Vince,

The image of the reverse is not coming in... Can you please repost?

[J Temple-West]

Here they be.

Vince, I'm afraid I don't like the hinge/catchplate set-up. I can't think of a maker that uses anything like it, and it's very close to a system used on a known fake.

Any ideas guys?

[J Temple-West]

Reverse

[PJS]

Reverse

Hi,

I am inclined to think this badge is ok....cant give a reason but I just think it is. I would prefer to judge it with it in my hand but of course that cant happen. Have a look at this one which I think is the same.

Phil

https://www.weitze.net/admin/sessions/rKyy5...88/M79988_1.jpg

https://www.weitze.net/admin/sessions/rKyy5...9988/M79988.jpg

[sftrooper86]

Hi,

I am inclined to think this badge is ok....cant give a reason but I just think it is. I would prefer to judge it with it in my hand but of course that cant happen. Have a look at this one which I think is the same.

Phil

https://www.weitze.net/admin/sessions/rKyy5...88/M79988_1.jpg

https://www.weitze.net/admin/sessions/rKyy5...9988/M79988.jpg

Thanks again Phil,

There may still be hope for this hobby yet!

Vince

[PKeating]

I am afraid that Hamburg dealers are hardly the yardstick by which one should judge originality, Phil. This badge does not conform in a number of ways to any known originals I have seen. The hinge is worrying but the Wehrmachtadler's head is even more troublng. I hope Vince did not pay too much for it. There again, as an object to dress a tunic mannequin, it is perfectly OK. Vince, didn't we do business before once? Were you not the guy who responded to some ads of mine, agreed a sale and then evaporated? Or am I confusing you with someone else?

PK

[PJS]

I am afraid that Hamburg dealers are hardly the yardstick by which one should judge originality, Phil. This badge does not conform in a number of ways to any known originals I have seen. The hinge is worrying but the Wehrmachtadler's head is even more troublng. I hope Vince did not pay too much for it. There again, as an object to dress a tunic mannequin, it is perfectly OK. Vince, didn't we do business before once? Were you not the guy who responded to some ads of mine, agreed a sale and then evaporated? Or am I confusing you with someone else?

PK

Hello Prosper

God I havent spoken to you in a long long time. A lot has happened since we last talked and yes I am still one of the few guys around who likes to think that too much bulls... goes on in this hobby. Where will it all end when good badges are binned because a grain of dirt or sand got caught in the die and shows up as a small dot on the otherwise perfect stamping. Personally I am well nigh sick of it all but again I keep coming back to these forums although very few others. In answer to your question I agree you cannot take any dealer as a yardstick (I have seen your postings elsewhere regarding certain Hamurg dealers) but not all they sell are fakes. At least this one and others do make refunds if you are not satisfied. Anyway good to talk to you again.

Vince I still think it is probably ok but I would love to see a few pics close up of the interior edges and check those dimensions against other examples as cast copies are smaller.

Phil

[sftrooper86]

I am afraid that Hamburg dealers are hardly the yardstick by which one should judge originality, Phil. This badge does not conform in a number of ways to any known originals I have seen. The hinge is worrying but the Wehrmachtadler's head is even more troublng. I hope Vince did not pay too much for it. There again, as an object to dress a tunic mannequin, it is perfectly OK. Vince, didn't we do business before once? Were you not the guy who responded to some ads of mine, agreed a sale and then evaporated? Or am I confusing you with someone else?

PK

Hello,

Which item were you selling and when? I just got home from Iraq about 3 months ago. I tried a little commo from there but our uplinks were not always reliable. If I was me I appologize but have to blame my Uncle Sam for any technical difficulties.

Please let me know though, I am now interested in the evaporation comment.

My best,

Vince

[PKeating]

I might be confusing you with someone else. I was selling 1st and 2nd Class Olympics decorations. Probably not you. No biggie.

Rgds,

PK

[sftrooper86]

I might be confusing you with someone else. I was selling 1st and 2nd Class Olympics decorations. Probably not you. No biggie.

Rgds,

PK

Not me!

V

[Joe D]

What is the verdict on this badge?

Edited November 10, 2007 by Joe D

[PJS]

Hi,

Prosper dont like it.....I would take a chance on it providing I had iron clad assurance of a refund if I didnt like it when I had it in my hand.

Phil

[PKeating]

http://www.hessenantique.com/Army_Flak_Badge_p/haga018.htm

PK

[PJS]

Thanks for the link Prosper and I agree it looks very similar if not the same in outline but the picture is way to pixilated to see any detail and of course there is no pic of the rear of the badge.....makes sense since you are not buying an original. Nevertheless, one must ask one self when they cast this repro badge as shown what did they use as a model to go by. Perhaps they used an original badge fior the mold perhaps not but as I said and I will stick by that....if the dealer will refund take a chance in life. Hell we were told never to buy flat backed panzer badges not that long ago. Adios amigo

Phil

[PKeating]

Taking uninformed chances when buying high end fakes of Third Reich militaria is a waste of time and money, in my opinion. I remember one notable dealer throwing a temper tantrum when a punter who had read an article by Eric Queen and myself about Army Parachutist Badges demanded a refund. The dealer sent him an e-mail offering a vastly reduced amount in return for the badge because of his questions about it on the Wehrmacht Awards Forums had "killed the value"!

By the way, the dealer to whose website I linked states that these repros are die-struck. I have been looking at my reference files to see if any maker produced a Heeres-Flakartillerieabzeichen that so closely resembled the early Tombak badges by C E Juncker but I haven't found one so far. Not that I am an authority on these badges. The badge that started this discussion might be an original. But it looks remarkably like the die-struck repro offered for $25.00 on that website.

PK

Edited November 12, 2007 by PKeating