Soviet Naval shoulder board question

[Ed_Haynes]

There are (or at least I have) very few sources on Soviet naval uniforms (they were so small, after all).

Question on the senior lieutenant boards shown. Engineer of some sort, but not normal engineer?

[Guest Rick Research]

My sources for the navy are notable by their absence as well.

My best impression would be that your Sr Lt was a torpedo-engineer.

Engine room "propulsion" engineers had a crossed wrench and hammer. But then that raises MY question, to add to yours since we are both in uncharted collecting waters:

Is there ANY way to tell if this is a pair of 1947+ ARMY technical engineering major's boards... or are they NAVY engineer Capt 3rd Rank?

[Rodion]

Hello,

In the "book of the red sailor" dated 1945, I found interesting plates

[Rodion]

next

[Rodion]

and the last.

[Rodion]

So according to the second plate, your shoulders boards are a navy ingeneer major and the button is silver coloured.

Best regards

Rodion

[Guest Rick Research]

Thanks! From the distinction between navy-style and army-style ranks, that also implies some sort of SHORE assignment, with land-based units. Rick

[Rodion]

Rick,

You're right, technical, justice, administrative, medical, veterinary, artillery, infantery officers used ranks of the army and not of the navy.

the question is quite complicated and we are waiting for the book about navy uniforms like this one which exists about air force in 3 parts. exceptional work !

Maybe this link will be helpfull :

http://www.military-uniform.narod.ru/navy/1951/index.htm

It is the regulation of 1951 about navy uniforms which describes all the shoulder boards in use.

Rodion

[Ed_Haynes]

Interesting link, Roidion.

Based on that, the only reference I could find to the insignia on the shoulder board with which I started the thread translates out as:

During the edition of Rules following changes are entered: to generals nonproduction, and quartermaster services it is established погон from gold волоки and выпушками crimson color. Color выпушек погон the generals of nonproduction service serving in aircraft, - blue. Color of stars on погонах - silver, buttons - gold.

To the officers of nonproduction service serving by the ships and in staffs of connections of the ships, signs on distinction of officers of ship service with obligatory carrying on погонах the emblem of the silver color representing шестерню with imposed on it трехлопастным by the screw are established.

In this connection item 50 to read in following edition:

" On погонах admirals engineering-ship, and also on погонах generals medical services and justices are imposed золоченые emblems. An emblem on погонах generals of artillery, nonproduction and veterinary services - silver color ".

Whatever that means . . . .

[Guest Rick Research]

"During the edition of Rules following changes are entered: to generals nonproduction, and quartermaster services it is established shoulder boards from gold braid and edging/underlay/"Waffenfarbe"in crimson color. Color underlay for shoulder boards of the generals of nonproduction service serving in aircraft, - blue. Color of stars on shoulder boards - silver, buttons - gold.

To the officers of nonproduction service serving by the ships and in staffs of connections of the ships, signs on distinction of officers of ship service with obligatory carrying on shoulder boards with the emblem of the silver color representing cogwheel with imposed on it a triple-bladed screw are established.

In this connection item 50 to read in following edition:

" On shoulder boards for admirals engineering-ship, and also on shoulder boards for generals medical services and justice are imposed gilded emblems. An emblem on shoulder boards for generals of artillery, nonproduction and veterinary services - silver color ".

What is Babelfisch mangling as "nonproduction?" I'm assuming in the context it actually says "non-executive branch" that is, non "zur See" as the German navy usage is for command officers.

And this appears to indicate that the old crossed hammer and spanner/wrench were replaced in 1951 by the cogwheel & propellor device.

Babelfisch- 0. Old Ricky brain- 1.

[Belaruski]

If of any use, the buttons are late 40's 50's