A Bar that?s have a prominent ehrenkreutz...

[hipnos]

Gentlemen, What do you think...

Miguel

and this other??

Edited May 1, 2008 by hipnos

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo hipnos

To my eye it looks like the 1934 Hindenberg Cross has been tacked on to the left front of the bar.

The last two medals on the first bar are Romanian:

The Romanian Order of the Star on Military virtue ribbon, strangely the Order of the Star has no swords (to indicate a wartime issue!!!) so therefore is a civil issue and should not be on a Military Virtur ribbon.

and the PELES Castle Medel, awarded to people who were present at the opening of the Romanian Royal Castle of Peles.

In WW1 Romania was fighting against the Germans, Austrians, etc..

Any chance to see close up pictures, and pictures of the rear.

Kevin in Deva.

[scottplen]

Hello

Was the romainian royal family related to Hohenzollen Family ?

Something is telling me the royal houses were conected!

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Scot

There was a connection, but that connection was broken in WW1,

so nothing that would justify a Romanian Civil Order of the Star on a War Merit Ribbon.

Or explain why the bar has a Hindenburg Combatant Cross at the start of the bar.

I really would like to see a picture of the rear of this bar.

Kevin in Deva (Transylvania)

Edited May 1, 2008 by Kev in Deva

[Guest Rick Research]

First bar is, I'd say, a sloppily homemade bar for a 1930s-?1950s attendant of the Hohenzollern family. The Silver Merit Medal X and no EK2 suggests a young perosn not long at the front 1914-18, but that Bavarian St. Michael Merit Cross indicates somebody with senior NCO-level status, so perhaps he was too old for much WW1, and this is from the 1930s.

I have the complete roll of the Hohenzollern Silver Merit Cross but I do NOT have the wartime Silver Medal X roll to match anyone up from.

Kev-- the Germans almost NEVER got Rumanian ribbons right. They are almost always WRONG. They took outdated model ribbons, or any old thing.

I'd say this belonged to somebody who was a family retainer between the wars, but too cheap (and not easily embarassed, yiiiii) so walked around in that UGLY bar.

The bar with the Wend Crown Merit Cross may very well be identifiable if and when the Mecklenburg rolls come out.

[hipnos]

Hallo hipnos

To my eye it looks like the 1934 Hindenberg Cross has been tacked on to the left front of the bar.

The last two medals on the first bar are Romanian:

The Romanian Order of the Star on Military virtue ribbon, strangely the Order of the Star has no swords (to indicate a wartime issue!!!) so therefore is a civil issue and should not be on a Military Virtur ribbon.

and the PELES Castle Medel, awarded to people who were present at the opening of the Romanian Royal Castle of Peles.

In WW1 Romania was fighting against the Germans, Austrians, etc..

Any chance to see close up pictures, and pictures of the rear.

Kevin in Deva.

Kev: I?ve see that the romanian medals are in the correct place, to the last of the Bar, The ribon of the star of romania, 1st type is the correct, if you look carefully there are two blue lines at the side of the ribbon that in the first type is the correct one...the "militara virtute" has only a blue line at both sides of the ribbon and the blue is lighter (take a look at my romanian bars at the showcase). I?ve never see a St Michael Bavarian merit cross, and two hohenzollern medals in the same bar (but probably I haven?t see so many like you and rick...). The Hindemburg cross in the first place is the piece that puzzled me...

I?ve see both at ebay and again in the second bar... I?d never see (out of books) a Mecklemburg wendish crown merit cross...and again: Why the prussian make so prominent the kriegshilfe cross ...???. A EKII would be a better looking first place for the bar...(I know, I know...that?s a capital sin...)

thanks to all of you...I must be the larges debtor in beers to all of you.....

Miguel

PS/ As I say you the bars are in ebay, impossible to show the rear face of both bars

[Kev in Deva]

Seems somebody liked it enough to bid: EUR 1.422,99 for it

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...A:IT&ih=025

I don't like the way the seller did not show a full back view of the item,

his pictures were carefully arranged so as NOT to show the rear fully in view.

Somebody has took and expensive Lemon in my opinion, considering, he has only 69 deals on Ebay.

ludwigderbayer1 (69*)

Kevin in Deva

[Stogieman]

The Hohenzollern Silver Cross of Merit paired with the Bavarian St. Michael Merit Cross.... ?? I think 1400- Euro was a pretty good deal myself......

[saschaw]

And "ludwigderbayer1" seems absolutely to know what he does. I don't know him but saw him several times bidding on best stuff that comes out of eBay...

[Kev in Deva]

Well to my untrained eye, it still looks like the bar has been messed with,

no doubt the items are real, but whats the point of buying a fantasy bar?

As I said before in my posts I dont like the way the seller arranged the pictures,

without showing a clear shot of the ribbon bar rear.

Kevin in Deva.

[Stogieman]

Hi Kev... sometimes, if you know what you're doing... a fantasy bar can be bought for less than the value od the parts. In this case, the bar is probably real... but even if it wasn't; you couldn't buy those two orders for much less than the 1400- for the bar. The Silver Merit Cross to The Princely Hohenzollern House Order has appeared on the market less than a half-dozen times in the past 10 years. Same with the Silver Merit Cross to The Bavarian Order of Saint Michael.... we're talking about pieces that appear so infrequently it's impossible to put a market-value on them.

[Guest Rick Research]

Having the Roll of the Hohenzollern Silver Merit Cross-- of which awards were still being made in the summer of 1945 (!), I know WHY they don't turn up for sale.

Since this was unquestionably a post-1918 award, that reduces the number of suspects to a mere fraction of the miniscule whole. Deduct foreigners and the list of suspects would be easily checkable IF there was a list of the Bavarian St Michael cross recipients.

If only my amazing knowledge of arcane and unknown lore was matched by a budget large enough to make purchases... without even knowing WHY something is extra special nice. Sigh.