Royal Navy gun crews

[coldstream]

Firstly I'd like to welcome Simon and thought I would post two recent photographs for your views.

The first shows what I believe to be is a Royal Navy gun crew on an early submarine. I have based this identification on the very narrow deck space and small calibre of the gun in use. (any identification of the gun would be welcome) The low superstructure behind the crew follows the general shape of a submarine conning tower and I have to say I for one would not want to stand there in a rough sea.

It certainly appears to be an earlier model submarine than the L class used by the Royal Navy but know nothing else.

[coldstream]

The second photo shows a much larger calibre weapon and is obviously on a surface vessel. I particulalry like the ready use ammunition mounted in the gun mount base allowing easy access through a 360 degree traverse.

[Simon F]

Hi Coldstream, many thanks for the welcome and sorry for the late reply, I have been flitting around a bit with the job recently.

Excellent pictures.

The first picture certainly seems to be a submarine and I think you are right in regards to this not being the L class, they had as far as I know the weapon mounted further up on a platform by the conning tower and not so far forward on the casing. I shall have a cast around and see what I can find out. Although I have to say that I have not seen the cross spar on a submarine and I am a thrown by the guardrails around the boat.

Edited July 1, 2008 by Simon F

[Simon F]

If you look at the link here, I think we are certainly into the realms of an early Motor Torpedo Boat for the first picture perhaps around the 1900's?

Let me know your thoughts?

http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/moto...rpedo_boats.htm

[coldstream]

Hello Simon and thanks for the reply.

I didn't think about the handrails I must admit and the cross spar is also odd for a sub.

Tucked up at work doing silly hours at the mo so will get to study your link in due course and get back to you.

Thanks again.

[Simon F]

It is most certainly a dead ringer for the pics HMML131 from the link, I have reproduced the pictures here, but will remove them if necessary.

The second pic has me thinking WWII

[censlenov]

My vote also goes for a Motorized Launch. At first i thoguht Q ship but the guns on those i believe were hidden and they wound have been a wider vessel i'm sure.

Cheers

Chris

[Simon F]

Thanks Chris for your observations.

My hunch about the second picture would be that it is a merchant ship or RN trawler, a lot of which would have been armed and manned by the RN in wartime. The indications for this are the relative small size of the gun, the apparent smallish size of the vessel and the general state of the rigging (merchant fleet don't hold as big a stock on upkeep and general appearance of vessels). The ship in company in the background also seems to be merchant by it's silhouette, which again could be a good indicator of this.

Edited July 1, 2008 by Simon F

[Simon F]

I think my hunch about this being mercantile or a trawler is close to the mark.

If you study the picture you will see some of the clues that I am looking at.

1. The angle of the mast suggests that this is the forward end of the ship which would suggest this vessel is going in the opposite direction to the one silhouetted, perhaps this unit is on protection/picket duty? I would think that this mast positioning would not be seen on anything other than a trawler/medium sized merchantman.

2. The horn in the picture would be facing away from the bow to prevent water ingress from the waves breaking over again suggesting that this is the front end.

It would be difficult to tie this down to a specific vessel as there would be umpteen variations of this kind of ship, especially merchant.

I have included two pics here. One showing the mast configuration and angles of, the other showing a naval pipe facing away from the bow, hopefully this gives you an idea behind my reasoning. I would be interested to hear other view points.

[coldstream]

Simon, thanks for all that information. The first picture is, I'm sure a motorised gun boat, no doubt about it. Thanks again for that link too.

The indicators in the second one you point out would also make me agree with your identification, thanks.

Its just a pity there's nothing on the back to indicate a particular ship but that would be asking too much! :cheers:

[Simon F]

My pleasure. Hopefully I will come across some snippet that will clue me into an ID of the second pic for sure., I will let you know as and when.

I hope you will post something else to get the proverbial nashers into.

[Simon F]

The gun that you can see in the first picture I reckon is the Vickers 3 pounder.

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_3pounder_V_mk1.htm