Religious Order? Fraternal Order? Any Order At all?

[Bill Dienna]

Well, my friends, here's hoping that you can help. I have tried to research this but so far I am coming up with nothing.

A large white hooded robe, lined in red. On the left breast is a red cross. The cross is similiar to a Lorraine Cross, except that on these items the top horizontal bar is WIDER than the lower horizontal bar.

There is also a neck badge, of the same design, surmounted with a crown, and suspended from a black neck ribbon.

Any thoughts would be welcome!

[Bill Dienna]

The neck badge:

[Alex K]

The neck badge:

Not KKK by any chance

[Bill Dienna]

No, I'm pretty certain it has nothing to do with the Klan at all. The Klan has its own symbology, and it's got nothing like this cross to my knowledge, let alone a neck order with a crown on it. The hood element to the robe reminds me of a religious order garment, and it's really not a robe so much as it is a cloak.

[Ulsterman]

Not KKK by any chance

No it is Catholic of some sort, methinks Catholic fraternal too. Let me have a snout round my Vatican stuff.

:rolleyes:

[Bill Dienna]

No it is Catholic of some sort, methinks Catholic fraternal too. Let me have a snout round my Vatican stuff.

Thanks, U-Man !

I was thinking Catholic fraternal as well, but I cannot seem to identify the cross as being anything Catholic. Any help is appreciated!

[Guest Rick Research]

The Patriarchal Cross is normally associated with Orthodox Christianity...

the Crown throws me.

I wonder if it'sone of those "pretender" thingums like (making up a name) the Most Holy & Ancient Sacred Order of Antioch (founded 1993) or that sort of thing?

You will be VERY popular this Halloween, in any event. :cheers:

[Bill Dienna]

I wonder if it'sone of those "pretender" thingums like (making up a name) the Most Holy & Ancient Sacred Order of Antioch (founded 1993) or that sort of thing?

They're the ones with the hand grenades, right?

As for Halloween:

Her: Hey, Bill, great outfit !

Me: Thanks.

Her: What are you supposed to be?

Me: I have absolutely no idea.

And isn't a "patriarchal cross" similiar to a cross of lorraine, with the top horizontal bar being shorter than the one beneath it?

Edited August 27, 2008 by Bill Dienna

[Guest Rick Research]

Yassssss, but Hippolyte deGansfjord-Buonaparte-Lipinski types would not necessarily be obsessed with accuracy or they wouldn't be Pretenders to the Windborne Empire of Axuaca or whatever.

Her: Hey, Bill, great outfit !

Me: Thanks.

Her: What are you supposed to be?

Me: I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you with this big sharp knife underneath here.

What clues does the cloak label reveal as to origin and time period? (3 digit phone number would be better than Machine Wash Warm/Tumble Dry )

[Bill Dienna]

Maybe this is the outfit of the fellow who renders the warning...

Follow. But. Follow only if ye be men of valour, for the entrance to this cave is guarded by a creature so foul, so cruel that no man yet has fought with it and lived. Bones of full fifty men lie strewn about its lair. So, brave knights, if you do doubt your courage or your strength, come no further, for death awaits you all with nasty, big, pointy teeth.

As for the label in the cloak...both the label and the material seem of modern origin. The manufacturer was in Mississippi or Alabama. There is not enough nomenclature to make a determination about much else. In other words, no telephone number and no street address, so the presence or absence of a postal zip code isn't applicable.

But now it occurs to me: When I get home I'll check the company's name to see if it is still in operation. If so, maybe a quick call or letter will answer the question.

[Nick]

Preceptor's robe of the United Religious, Military, and Masonic Orders of the Temple, and of St.John of Jerusalem, Palestine, Rhodes, and Malta, of England, and the Provinces overseas

[Bill Dienna]

Preceptor's robe of the United Religious, Military, and Masonic Orders of the Temple, and of St.John of Jerusalem, Palestine, Rhodes, and Malta, of England, and the Provinces overseas

Whoa ! That's a mouthful! Impressive sounding, that's for sure.

Thank you, Chairman, for the guidance.

(Why do I feel like I just addressed Mao?)

O.K., now I'm off to look for information on that....group.

But first I'm going to go look up "Preceptor".

Thanks so much again!

Any ideas about that neck badge and what it might be called?

[Guest Rick Research]

The Preceptors were the gaolers of Azhkabad Prison in the Harry Potter books.

[Bill Dienna]

From Dictionary.com:

?noun

1. an instructor; teacher; tutor.

2. the head of a school.

3. the head of a preceptory.

I wonder what the role is in the Masonic world?

[Ulsterman]

Nope-

I was wrong.

Having ransacked my (extensive) Catholic library what I thought was a member Monks' robe of the Saragossan Monastic Order of St. Michael is in fact- not. I then searched through Lithuanian and Latvian stuff and found a lot of similar stuff, but they clearly wear dark robes.

So, no idea. I doubt it's legit Masonic, but maybe it's Spanish or old English Masonic. They have some wild stuff.

However, it looks suspiciously like a film prop, Halloween costume or perhaps fantasy role-playing costume.

Edited August 28, 2008 by Ulsterman

[Ulsterman]

Well, maybe Nick is right. I called a fellow brother and he says there is a Preceptors' Order in the UK and they often have crowns on the insignia-being royally appointed and all, so who knows? Preceptors are past Masters and its' an invitation-only society. i suspect it's function is to drink and play golf, as for so many other fine fraternal orders provide a rubric.

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Well, maybe Nick is right. I called a fellow brother and he says there is a Preceptors' Order in the UK and they often have crowns on the insignia-being royally appointed and all, so who knows? Preceptors are past Masters and its' an invitation-only society. i suspect it's function is to drink and play golf, as for so many other fine fraternal orders provide a rubric.

It is the mantle and neck cross of the SMOTJ / OSMTH - The Sovereign Military Order of the Order of Jerusalem, also known as the Knights Templar. Not to be confused with the Masonic Templars, the SMOTH was a refounded Knights Templar from 1804 in France and now primarily based in the USA with international membership of about 5000. I am one myself. The Lorainne cross is mostly used by their American knights. Europeans use the cross pattee or Maltese cross. See: http://www.osmth.org/

[ladybird]

As a member and wearer of this regalia in the UK...Nick in #11 is correct