"Preu?ischer Landeskriegerverband" AND "L?wenorden" - Questions of Classes

[wschmidt]

Hello People,

I see some Weimar Awards (official and non-official), these Remember Great War Awards with 2 Classes of Medal, for exemple:

"L?wenorder" - 2 classes: bronze with ribbon and silver with pin

and

"Preu?ischer Landeskriegerverband" - 2 classes: silver with ribbon and gold with pin, as below:

If these awards are remember awards of the IWW, why have 2 classes???? May be officer or no officer????? Combatent or non-combatent? I don't understand... Another medals these period have 2 classes as these 2 awards...

Regards,

William Schmidt

[Eric Stahlhut]

there are actually 4 classes: a pinback star, a neck cross, a pinback cross, and a ribboned cross.

[Ulsterman]

Because the classes meant different things. The Prussian veterans' honor medals were only given to fewer than 10% of the membership for merited service to the veterans' association. The gold ones were REALLY rare and given for the same thing-and for longer time served in the association. People who got the #1 class for example included most of the senior 50 year plus chapter "fuhrers" as well as occasionally, some REALLY old vets. I have newspaper clippings of awards in 1931 to surviving veterans of the 1866 war against Austria-65 years later. One old man was a veteran of the 1848 troubles too! He was 102 years old.

Edited April 7, 2009 by Ulsterman

[Guest Rick Research]

I thought we had posted the regulations on the INCREDIBLY ugly and bizarrely suspended Prussian oversized vets crosses... can't find the old link.

I've got the actual 1920s regulations around someplace and can't put my hands on them at the moment, but recall clearly

the 2nd Class was never to be given to more than 1 in 10 members of any local group, while

1st class could not be given to more than 1 in 100 members of a local group for

merit within that local veterans group.

No idea what towns that only had 73 members would have done.

So those at least had some "selectivity" to them, and statutory limitations. Weirdly, because they were SO local, they also escaped the Nazi Verbot on other veterans awards-- I've seen documents for them into the Second War years, same awards being issued with paperwork from the NSKB. These could not, of course, be "legally" WORN, but apparently they pinned them on at meetings after 1935.

The "Lion Order," as a purchased vanity piece, simply had different types so that people would BUY them.

[Eric Stahlhut]

there are actually 4 classes: a pinback star, a neck cross, a pinback cross, and a ribboned cross.

clarification:

verbands-ehrenzeichen sonderstufe (steckstern)

ehrenkreuz 1. klasse (halskreuz)

ehrenkreuz 2. klasse (steckkreuz)

ehrenkreuz 3. klasse (am band)

:cheers:

[KIR]

there are actually 4 classes: a pinback star, a neck cross, a pinback cross, and a ribboned cross.

Hi,

four classes??? I only know from 2. classes! The (golden) first class was changed (in August 1925)

from the neck-cross to the pinback-cross.

Best regards,

Jens

[Eric Stahlhut]

ah, thank you jens.

so andre huesken was wrong?

p.s. not to mention the fahnenmedaille 25 or 50...usw

Edited April 4, 2009 by Eric Stahlhut

[KIR]

ah, thank you jens.

so andre huesken was wrong?

... yes - I think so!

[Eric Stahlhut]

!?!

[Eric Stahlhut]

[KIR]

... yes - we have twins!

[wschmidt]

And the L?wenorder? It was for longer time too?

[KIR]

Hallo William,

here a Link about the L?wenorden: http://www.traditionsverband.de/schutztruppe/loewen.html

Best regards,

Jens

[wschmidt]

Hi,

four classes??? I only know from 2. classes! The (golden) first class was changed (in August 1925)

from the neck-cross to the pinback-cross.

Best regards,

Jens

Hello Jens,

For your text: The concession of the first class cross ocurr obligatorily after the concession of the secund class cross. Both the decorations could not simultaneously be granted.

But, which was the criterion for the concession? Time service? Another official awards?

Why the decorated one received first class cross?

Regards,

William Schmidt

[KIR]

Hello William,

... For your text: The concession of the first class cross ocurr obligatorily after the concession of the secund class cross. Both the decorations could not simultaneously be granted.

yes - that's right!

But, which was the criterion for the concession? Time service? Another official awards?

I don't know, probably for honorary or for merits (for the union)??

Why the decorated one received first class cross

Probably for "more" honorary and for "more" merits or for a jubilee (like: Time service)??

Sorry - I don't know!

Best regards,

Jens

Edited April 24, 2009 by KIR