Beau Newman Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 I came upon this group several years ago at an OVMS show. At the time, I had not seen many of the pre-war Bavarian MVKs so, I didn't realize how well made these early pieces were. This one is marked 900 GH on the edge of the center medallion. The group even has what appears to be a legit post-1913 2nd class w/o swords. The ribbon for the Hindenburg cross is a bit odd. Possibly a case of an attempt to replace an earlier veteran's piece? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Newman Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share Posted May 30, 2009 The reverse: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Newman Posted May 30, 2009 Author Share Posted May 30, 2009 A close-up of the top of the later MVK: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deruelle Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Strange that he received EK2 and no swords on its Bavarian medals ! Probably a Beamter ! It will be interresting to see other commentsChristophe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Card Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 :love: One fine bar, Beau! :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saschaw Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Very nice group, however I have to claim that the 3rd modell MVK had swords, almost sure. It is not on peace time ribbon, and if it were I guess it should replace the 2nd class of 2nd model. But yet, this alone is makes it a great bar! Had my MVK2/2 for years and it was hard to give it away... Might the ribbon on the Ehrenkreuz be one for the Kyffh?userbund medal? They sometimes swapped only the medals and continued to wear then non matching ribbons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Looks like somebody swapped a M1913 peacetime MVK2 (RARE!!!) for some class of wartime award in first place. Drop dead beautiful M1905 in 2nd place. Last award was certainly an XXIV Years Service Cross from the height of the clip, so somebody played with switching things--an ordinary bar with very much not ordinary awards put on it! :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saschaw Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 Looks like somebody swapped a M1913 peacetime MVK2 (RARE!!!) for some class of wartime award in first place.Sorry, I did not get that. Do you agree or disagree when I say the 2nd model is proper while the 3rd model seems to have its swords lost or removed? I hardly doubt this is a real but misplaced 2nd class of 3rd modell... is it real silver? Those 1913 models without swords are amungst the rarest Bavarian decorations. Don't want to intend it cannot be just as it's rare, but on a altered (see long service award) medal bar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 M1905 (all silver) is perfect.M1913 (enamel center disk)-- suspension scroll would show signs of being filed out through the top plating if Xs had been removed. Any deceptions I have seen just have the Xs unscrewed leaving a little round hole, not the carved out space on this cross. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Newman Posted May 31, 2009 Author Share Posted May 31, 2009 As far as the M1913 being silver, it could be but, there are no hallmarks that I can find. The example in Nimmergut (#505, page 194) is noted as silvered Alpakka. I really can't find any signs of swords having been removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saschaw Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I finally found closer information on MVKs 3rd modell in Orden-Militaria-Magazin #41, June 1991. On peace time ribbon, there were awarded up to August 1914:MVK 1st class with the crown: 6MVK 1st class: 9MVK 2nd class with the crown: 39MVK 2nd class: 59MVK 3rd class with the crown: 6MVK 3rd class: none (sic!)Oddly, there were three more awarded in war time on peace time ribbon: MVK 1st class: 2MVK 2nd class with the crown: 1And, what I never had heard of before, Beamte did get the crosses without swords on "Kriegsverdienst" ribbon (but that was the so-called "Beamtenband"!) between August 1914 and July 26th 1915. This adds:MVK 1st class with the crown: 26MVK 1st class: 367MVK 2nd class with the crown: 475MVK 2nd class: 177MVK 3rd class with the crown: 71MVK 3rd class: 24. With decree from 26th july 1915, those Beamte were entitled to get swords for their crosses, and we can assume most did get these, as they meant "in front of the enemy decorated". I have hardly ever seen a real MVK 3rd modell issue without swords (well, now we know why), but the article shows two crosses 2nd class - both real silver. I don't know when they did change but, well... not all at Nimmergut's opus magnum is correct. I'd rather not buy a Alpacca silvered 3rd modell 2nd class without swords. You might add swords (or rather a cross with swords, if you believe in the cross) and this is a very, very nice bar. :catjava: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Newman Posted June 4, 2009 Author Share Posted June 4, 2009 Excellent info. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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