What are your opinions on this 105mm round or

[Brian Wolfe]

Hello everyone,

First let me explain that I work for a quasi-governmental body where for some reason security is extremely tight and my coworkers have no sense of humour regarding most of what I am about (military interest) . A week ago the item which is the subject of this post showed up on my desk. I had been expecting it to be there as another empolyee was getting rid of it and I said I'd take it off his hands. As you can imagine there was quite a stir in the office at the sight of this ordance, albeit inert.

Anyway, it's a 105mm round and from my searches on the internet it looks like it is meant to be mounted in an artillery shell of some sort. The ones I found were H.E.A.T. rounds which I think stands for High Explosive Anti Tank round. It weighs 20 pounds and is 26 inches long. I am hoping that some of the members can help me with more information on this round. I think the only stampings show up quite well in the second photo.

Oh yes, the office settled down after I took the "bomb" to my truck.

God, it's going to be a long time until retirement!

Thanks for any information you can give me.

Regards

Brian

[Brian Wolfe]

Here are the markings.

MWC-1-18-1974 105MM TP-T

Thanks again for your help.

Regards

Brian

[Guest Rick Research]

Buncha SISSIES. Everybody knows when the fuze at the nose is removed the only way all that high explosive packed in the body can detonate is

if it drops on the floor or

if high pitched nasal squealing makes it vibrate.

Yeesh.

(I used to have an expended poison gas cylinder filched off one of our nearby Off Limits old disused naval target islands. No one ever stole anything from MY dorm room in college....)

[Brian Wolfe]

Rick you have no idea. If I tell one more joke about scraping an endangered species off my boot I think I'll be sacked.

Talk about a group that needs to lighten up.

Regards

Brian

[Mervyn Mitton]

Sorry Brian - you may be a friend, but quite honestly I wouldn't want you in the same office with a mortar bomb .....

[Pylon1357]

Funny, I was looking about the net the other day fro information on a 105mm brass casing I have. I came across a projectile like this, but I can not find it again.

It is a HEAT High Explosive Anti Tank projectile.

MWC is the manufacturer. But I can not recall the name nor the site I was at. 1-18-1974 is the date of manufacture, January 18 1974.

TP-T If I recall is Training Projectile Tank.

Edited October 30, 2009 by Pylon1357

[Brian Wolfe]

Sorry Brian - you may be a friend, but quite honestly I wouldn't want you in the same office with a mortar bomb .....

Oh fine, play with a little high explosive device and your friends desert you. Well...the smarter friends anyway.

Brian

[Brian Wolfe]

Funny, I was looking about the net the other day fro information on a 105mm brass casing I have. I came across a projectile like this, but I can not find it again.

It is a HEAT High Explosive Anti Tank projectile.

MWC is the manufacturer. But I can not recall the name nor the site I was at. 1-18-1974 is the date of manufacture, January 18 1974.

TP-T If I recall is Training Projectile Tank.

Thanks Pylon. I could not figure out what the TP-T stood for but as usual once it is pointed out it becomes so clear. I would have never thought about MWC being the initials of the manufacturer. Do you know if these were fired by a tank or from an artillery piece? Also would any 105mm casing from the same time period be correct to display this prijectile in or was there somthing "special" about the casing for this particular round?

Thanks again.

Regards

Brian

[Pylon1357]

Thanks Pylon. I could not figure out what the TP-T stood for but as usual once it is pointed out it becomes so clear. I would have never thought about MWC being the initials of the manufacturer. Do you know if these were fired by a tank or from an artillery piece? Also would any 105mm casing from the same time period be correct to display this prijectile in or was there somthing "special" about the casing for this particular round?

Thanks again.

Regards

Brian

Hello Brian, I am really out of my league here as I am just starting to become interested in this stuff. Based on the stamping TP-T I would gather it is a tank projectile. In fact I think this is the projectile that fits with the 105mm casing I was researching. The Brass case I have is for a Leopard 1, the case is dated 1070 and has the British Broad Arrow stamp on it. If I may suggest, post this over at BOCN or if you are not a member, with your permission, I can post it there.

Again, as I said, I am just starting to learn about these things.

[Brian Wolfe]

Hello Brian, I am really out of my league here as I am just starting to become interested in this stuff. Based on the stamping TP-T I would gather it is a tank projectile. In fact I think this is the projectile that fits with the 105mm casing I was researching. The Brass case I have is for a Leopard 1, the case is dated 1070 and has the British Broad Arrow stamp on it. If I may suggest, post this over at BOCN or if you are not a member, with your permission, I can post it there.

Again, as I said, I am just starting to learn about these things.

I am not a member there and if you wouldn't mind posting it on the BOCN I would greatly appreciate it, thanks Pylon1357.

Regards

Brian

[Hugh]

I am not a member there and if you wouldn't mind posting it on the BOCN I would greatly appreciate it, thanks Pylon1357.

Regards

Brian

It's a tank round. 105MM was the "standard" size before the recent 120MM came into service. The projection on the front allows for detonation at the proper standoff distance from the target to allow the explosive jet from the shaped-charge to form. Effectiveness of these rounds is highly dependent on the standoff distance and on striking at a 90 degree angle to the armor to be penetrated. In Vietnam, we defeated the RPG shaped-charge rounds by putting bar armor on vehicles, thus causing the round to explode at a greater distance from the armor / hull. The explosive jet was then greatly dissipated by the time it reached the hull.

[Laurence Strong]

The blue paint would indicate that it is a practice round.

[Kev in Deva]

Any ordnance in BLUE is a practice / Drill round.

Could cause damage if it fell off the desk onto somebody's foot though. :P

[Pylon1357]

I posted this over at BOCN, here is the reply I got.

Your bullet is the U.S. designation M490 TP-HEAT-T projo, the first standard practice round to simulate HEAT rounds for training. It is the exact shape and most likely weight and CG so that it flys the same as the HEAT projo. More recent versions omitted the tail boom and fins at the base. This projo was used from the 60s (Vietnam) up through the first Gulf War.

The proper case for it to loaded into is the M148 Brass or M148A1B1 steel. There are 3 case types for 105mm tank gun ammo in the U.S. The M148 has the shortest primer, so that the tail boom and fins can fit inside. You could place it in either the M150B1 case or the M115B1 case, but you would have to remove their primers to make room for the tail of your projo. The M148A1B1 case is the same used by the APFSDS-T projos, so there should be some around.

By the way TP-T stands for Target Practice Tracer. Almost all tank rounds have tracers to confirm trajectory.

[Pylon1357]

[Brian Wolfe]

WOW! Thanks for all of this information, it was much more than I could have hoped for.

Regards

Brian

[Pylon1357]

WOW! Thanks for all of this information, it was much more than I could have hoped for.

Regards

Brian

Not a problem at all Brian. I try to help where ever I can in our world of collecting. I only wish my own knowledge had been better on this topic. It seems I have much much more to learn in regards to projectiles and the like.