Austria-Hungary Austrian U-Boat badge

[WJT]

My grandfather was assigned to U-IV from 1913 to 1916. When I got qualified in the US Submarine Service he gave me his U-Boat badge. Since then I have been collecting AH u-boat badges, some reproductions and many fakes. The fakes were intentional. I would like to know if anyone has information and/or references on makers, hallmarks, periods made and where they were made and where they are currently being made.

Thanks,

Bill

[Tim B]

Bill,

Post some PIC's of your collection, I would love to see them.

Here's a link for you: http://www.ww1medals.net/SMU-4.html

Tim

[Guest IMHF]

WWII GERMAN BADGE - SUBMARINE CLASP - REPLICA I know you are looking for WWI, I just posted these here for others to share;)

http://quanonline.co...e_sub_clasp.php

Lorenzo

Edited August 13, 2010 by IMHF

[Guest IMHF]

Here is another link I found if you have not seen it yet, look forward to seeing your collection of Uboat Badge. Know this is not WWI era just posted these here for others to share.

http://www.unterseeb...iegsmarine2.htm

Lorenzo

Edited August 13, 2010 by IMHF

[WJT]

The sailor is my grandfather

[WJT]

Here is my collection - No 1 was my grandfather's

[Tim B]

Hi Bill,

That's a lot of Austrian U-boat badges! Are they all authentic and can you tell us what some of the differences there are between them? Or, are you just trying to corner the market on these? Just kidding.

It's really nice you have the one from your grandfather, really lovely piece of personal family history there.

Tim

[trakkles]

Hi,

nice, is it possible to show the backsides?

regards Trakkles

[Guest IMHF]

Here is my collection - No 1 was my grandfather's

Very nice Chart Display

Lorenzo

[Guest IMHF]

Hi,

nice, is it possible to show the backsides?

regards Trakkles

I would like to see the backsides as well, thank you.

Lorenzo

[WJT]

I will upload the backs on Monday

[WJT]

Here are the backs. No. 1 is my grandfather's

[trakkles]

Hello,

IMHO Nr. 1-4 is an aspirant for an original piece?

What do you think?

regards Trakkles

[Bosungus]

http://www.emedals.ca/catalog.asp?item=A901#bigPic

AustriaU-Boot Badge, WWIBadge in blackened white metal, tong on reverse in tombac, die struck, numbered “57” on the reverse bottom, circa 1917, Worn, very good condition and scarce

[Guest IMHF]

http://www.emedals.c...tem=A901#bigPic

AustriaU-Boot Badge, WWIBadge in blackened white metal, tong on reverse in tombac, die struck, numbered "57" on the reverse bottom, circa 1917, Worn, very good condition and scarce

That is very nice, good to know what the price ranges are, this one was $1,500.00 looks well aged;)

Lorenzo

[Tim B]

Hi,

IMO, the ones with the tongue look authentic but I would question items 8-11 for starters. They look quite modern from the pin setup and overall lack of quality. Bottom row may be post-war manufacturers? The other items are beyond me.

Can you tell us what is and what isn't? Thanks for showing!

Tim

[WJT]

#1 is the piece my grandfather gave me when I was awarded my US Navy Dolphins in 1975. He passed away in 1979. I have compared the BSW Hallmark with an Austrian Artillery Qualification Badge I have and there is only a slight difference. I found a reference that stated that the artillery badge was stopped being made in 1913. Also as I understand it, all original Gov. issued pieces were only given out to individuals actually assigned to a boat and were collected when the individual left the boat. All of these badges were supposedly destroyed after the war. As a side note, being a submarine sailor myself, I have an idea of what these guys went through in these unproven machines and after sinking and/or damaging some of the British, French and Italian greatest warships I believe it unlikely that the Empire would have collected them all and destroyed them- just my opinion.

I have seen reference that they were only issued to the enlisted and only after completion of Submarine school. Officers were allowed to purchase their own from a private manufacturer like BSW. I have also seen reference to the badge being awarded to enlisted graduates of submarine school who graduated at the head of their class prior to the beginning of the war. It is possible that the piece I received from my grandfather is either the one awarded or possibly one he purchased it himself.

#2 is a copy of #1 that a friend of mine cast in silver from a mold he made of the original.

#'s 3 & 4 look authentic but the BSW Hallmarks are the same but differ considerably from #1. These may have been veteran's pieces or jeweler made pieces.

#5 & 7 I was told were fakes because of the smell. I have seen the clip on #5 on a museum copy being sold on the web so maybe it is one of them doctored. #7 has the same patina as #4.

#6 has a screw back and I believe it to be made in Poland or Czech Republic. Got it for $18.00

None of the pin backs are marked and probably reproductions because none of them really cost that much.

#8 – 10 looked like novelty pieces. #11 I received from a group I belong to in Salzburg Austria. #12 appears to be a period sweetheart pin with a five pointed starfish hallmark. #13 appears to be a period stick pin. #14 is a commemoration pin Welt Krieg 1914 -1916 Hochsee-Flotte. #15 cap badge. #16 stamped badge gold and silver color. #17 same as 16 but silver color back. #18 & 19 stamped, look to be made by the same maker. #20 is like #18 but aged. #21 beautifully finished but like current anodized finishes. #22 stamped like it is done in bright silver.

To make short story long, I collect just about every one of these I find (sans the $1500 piece). I am looking for a way to date the marked pieces with the history of BSW hallmark used before and during WWI. My grandfather's picture is at http://www.ww1medals.net/SMU-4.html

Regards

Edited August 17, 2010 by WJT

[Guest IMHF]

#1 is the piece my grandfather gave me when I was awarded my US Navy Dolphins in 1975. He passed away in 1979. I have compared the BSW Hallmark with an Austrian Artillery Qualification Badge I have and there is only a slight difference. I found a reference that stated that the artillery badge was stopped being made in 1913. Also as I understand it, all original Gov. issued pieces were only given out to individuals actually assigned to a boat and were collected when the individual left the boat. All of these badges were supposedly destroyed after the war. As a side note, being a submarine sailor myself, I have an idea of what these guys went through in these unproven machines and after sinking and/or damaging some of the British, French and Italian greatest warships I believe it unlikely that the Empire would have collected them all and destroyed them- just my opinion.

I have seen reference that they were only issued to the enlisted and only after completion of Submarine school. Officers were allowed to purchase their own from a private manufacturer like BSW. I have also seen reference to the badge being awarded to enlisted graduates of submarine school who graduated at the head of their class prior to the beginning of the war. It is possible that the piece I received from my grandfather is either the one awarded or possibly one he purchased it himself.

#2 is a copy of #1 that a friend of mine cast in silver from a mold he made of the original.

#'s 3 & 4 look authentic but the BSW Hallmarks are the same but differ considerably from #1. These may have been veteran's pieces or jeweler made pieces.

#5 & 7 I was told were fakes because of the smell. I have seen the clip on #5 on a museum copy being sold on the web so maybe it is one of them doctored. #7 has the same patina as #4.

#6 has a screw back and I believe it to be made in Poland or Czech Republic. Got it for $18.00

None of the pin backs are marked and probably reproductions because none of them really cost that much.

#8 – 10 looked like novelty pieces. #11 I received from a group I belong to in Salzburg Austria. #12 appears to be a period sweetheart pin with a five pointed starfish hallmark. #13 appears to be a period stick pin. #14 is a commemoration pin Welt Krieg 1914 -1916 Hochsee-Flotte. #15 cap badge. #16 stamped badge gold and silver color. #17 same as 16 but silver color back. #18 & 19 stamped, look to be made by the same maker. #20 is like #18 but aged. #21 beautifully finished but like current anodized finishes. #22 stamped like it is done in bright silver.

To make short story long, I collect just about every one of these I find (sans the $1500 piece). I am looking for a way to date the marked pieces with the history of BSW hallmark used before and during WWI. My grandfather's picture is at http://www.ww1medals.net/SMU-4.html

Regards

Awesome information

Lorenzo

[Magnusmilitaria]

Hello !

Some opinions about this KuK UB U Boot submarine badge ?

Thank you !

Mark

[Ian]

I have been researching the U-Boat badge for some time and here is a short version of some of that research.

The Imperial and Royal Austro-Hungarian Navy (K.u.K. Kriegsmarine) adopted
a distinctive badge for wear by the crews, but excluding officers, of their
submarines in October 1910. (Verordnungsblatt No.48 dated 15th October
1910).

The badge measured approx 56mm high x 36mm wide, was silver in
colour and consisted of the letters U and B either side of a fouled anchor.

The badge was awarded after having completed at least one voyage as a
member of a submarines crew.

No written or photographic evidence has been located to indicate that

the badge was issued to Officers. (Happy to be corrected).

Photographs showing Officers wearing the U-boat qualification badge are
post World War I, and indeed, most show former Austro-Hungarian Officers/sailors
serving in the German Kriegsmarine during World War II. Konteradmiral Paul
Meixner is often seen in wartime photos wearing his Austro-Hungarian U-Boat
badge.

The official issue badges were die struck and featured a full length,
wide ‘Spange’ mount or clip. This type of mounting arrangement was common to
most Austro-Hungarian period badges. The badge was made of brass (thio metal?)
and was silver in colour.

One known maker of this badge is BSW (Bruder Schneider Wien). Jewellers made pieces were also available
for private purchase.

Note: The badge continued to be manufactured after 1918 and well into the 1950’s by the firm of Rothe of Vienna (other jewellery
companies may also have manufactured thebadge). These badges were produced to satisfy those veterans who required replacement pieces. The badges were generally manufactured with a needle pin and catch arrangement.

Regards,

Ian

[williamj]

I am a collector of submariner's insignia with a soft spot for the Austro-Hungarian submariner's insignia,  Researching these i have come across  2 authors, Jorg Steiner in his book, and the Czech Pavel Patejdl in his article in Signum who say this badge exists with a horizontal pin.  Has anyone seen one of these? 

Here is a veteran restrike from Budapest i found

 

[WJT]

On 17/11/2018 at 16:58, williamj said:

I am a collector of submariner's insignia with a soft spot for the Austro-Hungarian submariner's insignia,  Researching these i have come across  2 authors, Jorg Steiner in his book, and the Czech Pavel Patejdl in his article in Signum who say this badge exists with a horizontal pin.  Has anyone seen one of these? 

Here is a veteran restrike from Budapest i found

 

Where can I find these two references

regards

Bill