BEM group question!

[paddywhack]

pretty sure i know the answer but never hurts to ask!!picked up this nice BEM group to a S/SGT Claude Paterson R.A.S.C on another forum and while its not to any mad cool unit i really wanted a BEM group and this fit the bill but i was wondering i have where it announces where he has been awarded the BEM in the london gazette but not why!i was reading that the later war BEMs just like the late war ww1 MMs dont have the citation as to why it was awarded!is there any hope of finding out how it was won???any help would be great!!

[paddywhack]

name on rim!!

[paddywhack]

and the rest of the rim! so is there any chance of find out why it was awarded? maybe unit history local papers if i can find him??

thanks for any help!! :beer:

[paul wood]

and the rest of the rim! so is there any chance of find out why it was awarded? maybe unit history local papers if i can find him??

thanks for any help!!

Your best bet would be to contact the museum where the corp journal may give more information.

You should contact the Royal Logistical Corps Museum (Who would have the ASC records)

Princess Royal Barracks,

Deepcut,

Nr Camberley, Surrey GU16 6RW

Many BEM are retirement gifts for long and meritorious service but I wish you luck and hope you can find out more about the guy.

All the best,

Paul

[IrishGunner]

Thanks for posting; I wasn't familiar with this medal. RASC and a Burma Star might turn-up something interesting - good luck in your BEM research.

[Paul L Murphy]

Try the documents online section of the UK's National Archives website. They have all of the WWII recommendation documents digitised and you can download them in pdf format for about £3 each.

[paddywhack]

Try the documents online section of the UK's National Archives website. They have all of the WWII recommendation documents digitised and you can download them in pdf format for about £3 each.

really!!!Fantastic il take look so!!!thanks for that!! :beer:

[paddywhack]

is this the right section as nothing seems to be coming up!!!!!and the annoying thing is i have seen other people with the same first or last name awarded the BEM!!!!!

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/browse-refine.asp?CatID=22&searchType=browserefine&pagenumber=1&query=*&queryType=1

(the national archives always stump me!!!!)

thanks for any help!!

oh and it was announced in the LG in july of 46!!

Edited September 29, 2010 by paddywhack

[Ralph]

Unfortunately the files pertaining to the NY Honours awards for 1946 (9.1.46) do not appear to be extant in the WO373 series (British Army Awards) or the AIR2 series (RAF Files relating to the BEM/GM/GC awards committee containing the discussion papers on those awards to all 3 services).

The 1946 file (AIR2/9289) just states "owing to the shortage of time and the large number of recommendations the Committee have adopted the unusual procedure of agreeing the ommissions from the New Years List with the departments concerned, rather than circulating the citations for general criticism."

It is mentioned that proposed were

Admiralty 275 of which 260 were approved

War Office 750 of which 693 were approved

Air MInistry 545 of which 530 were approved.

I have yet to find any Army recommendations for the BEM for NY (or Birthday) Honours awarded in 1946

[paddywhack]

Unfortunately the files pertaining to the NY Honours awards for 1946 (9.1.46) do not appear to be extant in the WO373 series (British Army Awards) or the AIR2 series (RAF Files relating to the BEM/GM/GC awards committee containing the discussion papers on those awards to all 3 services).

The 1946 file (AIR2/9289) just states "owing to the shortage of time and the large number of recommendations the Committee have adopted the unusual procedure of agreeing the ommissions from the New Years List with the departments concerned, rather than circulating the citations for general criticism."

It is mentioned that proposed were

Admiralty 275 of which 260 were approved

War Office 750 of which 693 were approved

Air MInistry 545 of which 530 were approved.

I have yet to find any Army recommendations for the BEM for NY (or Birthday) Honours awarded in 1946

thats why i cant find anythinks!thanks for the info though!il try the route of contacting the reg mesuem!thanks again!

[leigh kitchen]

I have a vague recollection from the 1970's of sergeants / staff sergeants being awarded BEMs following extended periods of acting in an officer's role, as platoon commanders and the like.

[dante]

I have a vague recollection from the 1970's of sergeants / staff sergeants being awarded BEMs following extended periods of acting in an officer's role, as platoon commanders and the like.

I hope I am wrong but IMHO the BEM is renamed, Paul

[FrontlineAntiques]

I hope I am wrong but IMHO the BEM is renamed, Paul

I had the same feeling...

I can see the a faint outline of an 'R' and the lines running along the rim look like it could have been prviously polished down and renamed. I hope I am wrong

Dan

[paddywhack]

well i took my new magnifying glass out and had a god old strain of my eyes! cant see any ghost impression of digits or letters,i got a bit of water on the offending "R" and well it came away with a light rub(fear not i didnt clean it!!) il get a friend of mine to take more pics of it as i honestly cant see any ghost letter!plus why re-name it to the army service corps????

thanks though!! :beer:

[Mervyn Mitton]

Paddywhack - I have looked carefully and can't see any direct impressions from a re-naming. I don't particularly like the horizontal lines in the rim metal - but, these could be from any number of reasons. Unless you can actually see an old impression, I think you are OK - but , Paul and Dan were right to mention it to you.

Having said that, I've just had another quick look and the lettering doesn't seem even on the 'A' 'T' and 'S' on Paterson ,with the gap wide between the 'R' and 'S'. Perhaps it is just the magnification ?

Edited December 9, 2010 by Mervyn Mitton

[paddywhack]

nope they were right to mention it! made me have a good look at it but cant see anything to be honest!iv a erased MM and you can clearly see where it was erased and the ghost of the lettering etc!

:beer:

[dante]

nope they were right to mention it! made me have a good look at it but cant see anything to be honest!iv a erased MM and you can clearly see where it was erased and the ghost of the lettering etc!

PW, My concern is IMHO the naming is not correct for a BEM, it also looks to be skimmed, could we have a picture of the rim, I do however hope I am wrong, cheers, Paul

[paddywhack]

PW, My concern is IMHO the naming is not correct for a BEM, it also looks to be skimmed, could we have a picture of the rim, I do however hope I am wrong, cheers, Paul

il have to get a friend to do its i just dont have a camera that can do those sorts of clear pics but hopefuly i can get it done in the next few days and il post em uo!thanks again! :beer:

[dante]

Just picked up this tip from another forum member "carefully place the rim on a flat surface - a good medal should balance - a renamed one should be unsteady - be careful not to cause damage"

or

"Pick up a medal, look at the rim and tilt it backwards and forwards. On a perfectly flat rim you'll see a reflected STRIP of light If your medal has been erased and renamed, the edge is almost always imperceptibly curved. The reflection off a curved rim is seen more like a POINT of light rather than a strip".

Hope this helps, Paul

[paddywhack]

i was looking at some other BEMS on this other forums thread

http://www.britishmedalforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=161&t=62781

and seems that others have seen tool marks similir to mine on the rims of BEMs!

Edited January 19, 2011 by paddywhack