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The Grenadier Guards wear the "flamed grenade" as a cap badge, ranks below full sergeant ("gold sergeant") and other than musicians (the guards term for what the army generally call bandsmen) wear the grenade with no device on the ball.

The grenade has been worn since 1896 when it was introduced for wear on the forage cap and continues unchanged in basic design although the materials used have varied.

Properly made of a yellow metal whch Kipling & King refer to as being gilding metal rather than brass, a WWI economy issue in brass would have been worn 1916 - c1919, but who can tell the metals apart?

K&K 891 refers to these gilding metal badges, as does Gaylor, both show the 17 pointed flame version & make no mention of the other less full flamed versions.

Both show smaller flamed badges but only of the types with devices on the ball, such as the full sergeants & musicians etc.

Some collectors feel that the smaller flamed 14, 15, 16 pointed flame badges are Canadian Grenadier Guards badge, but photographs & postcards show these & the 17 point flame badges worn by both British & Canadian.

During WWII a plastic economy version was issied, these were to be worn alongside the gilding metal badge, units were not to standardize on one version or the other so some men within a unit could wear brass, others plastic.

Often referred to as "being of "bakelite", these badges were actually of plastic.

Later an gold coloured anodised aluminium version was issued, and a cloth embroidered version of a noticably different design to the norm.

A blackened yellow metal version of the badge was also issued.

This photo shows a badge with 18 points to the flames:

Edited by leigh kitchen

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I can't remember when the crowned garter & cypher design took over from the grenade shoulder strap device, yep, the GS buttons are wrong but there should be plenty of KGV or KGVI Grenadier's buttons around - I don't know which king's buttons are right for this particular.

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The gold coloured anodised aluminium issue, K&K volume 2 page 23 refers to this in text.

An ex-Grenadier of Queen's Company 1st Bn in the 70's did'nt know these existed, having been issued a yellow metal one.

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This embroidered badge was issued to 1st Bn GG in 1973 - I saw it in wear in the Creggan in @Derry that year & my ex-Grenadier mate tells me that they were a short lived badge issued for a 4 month Emergency Tour.

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This embroidered badge is the NCO's arm badge, issued in lieu of the beret badge proper because of shortages during the 1st Bn's 1973 tour of "Derry.

Edited by leigh kitchen

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Blackened yellow metal issued to 1st Bn GG for a tour of North Armagh in 1976, according to my ex-Grenadier informant - it was produced blackened, not unit painted.

I don't know if this badge is still in use.

Edited by leigh kitchen

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This badge has 16 points or perhaps 17 to the flame

:catjava: "GREETINGS & SALUTATIONS!" Chris, I removed the red from the background and lightened the image of the Grenadier Guard epaulette for you here! :Cat-Scratch: Sarge Booker of Tujunga, California :cat:

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:catjava: "GREETINGS & SALUTATIONS!" Chris, I removed the red from the background and lightened the image of the Grenadier Guard epaulette for you here! :Cat-Scratch: Sarge Booker of Tujunga, California :cat:

The shoulder strap bears the cypher of King George VI in the centre of the design - so the buttons required bear that version of the cypher, slightly less ornate & more squared off than the King George V version.

King George VI - 1936 - 52, but I would imagine that there was quite an overlap with the insignia change at both ends of the reign, though having said that, King Edward VIII insignia was produced for the GG, & he was only around for what - was it 18 months or less?

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I've just shovelled out the space under the stairs and come up with these three GG buttons. I think that these are all I've got but who knows what lurks in unexplored drawers. Are they George V or George VI and is the other Ted VII or Ted VIII ? What do you think Leigh? I haven't a clue. At least these give CB an idea of what to look for. I'm pretty sure that the buttons on the front of the jacket would be the larger (25mm-ish) and the epaulette buttons the smaller (19mm-ish) ones

Must clean that scanner bed :blush: .

Edited by Jim Maclean

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The left hand & centre buttons are King George V ? the cipher of King George VI draws in slightly at the bottom rather than widens slightly as these do.

The right hand button is King Edward VII, his cypher is similarly shaped to that of K George V, narrowing at the top.

Buttons were issued for King Edward VIII?s reign, & his cypher is similar to QE II?s but more crowded & squarer looking in the middle., & their ciphers don?t narrow at the top like King Edward VII?s.

What else have we got in Davey Jones's locker?

Yes, I just noticed the bits of stuff there - Old Navy Shag steeped in rum or something like that?

Edited by leigh kitchen

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The left hand & centre buttons are King George V ? the cipher of King George VI draws in slightly at the bottom rather than widens slightly as these do.

The right hand button is King Edward VII, his cypher is similarly shaped to that of K George V, narrowing at the top.

Buttons were issued for King Edward VIII?s reign, & his cypher is similar to QE II?s but more crowded & squarer looking in the middle., & their ciphers don?t narrow at the top like King Edward VII?s.

What else have we got in Davey Jones's locker?

Yes, I just noticed the bits of stuff there - Old Navy Shag steeped in rum or something like that?

Thanks for the info Leigh. On the other I wish I had bits of stuff sitting on my scanner, more than likely an Old Navy Shag :rolleyes:

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Leigh, i'm new to this forum. my main interest are collecting badge's ( grenade ) to the Grenadier Guards. I am and have been now for many years trying to find out when the Grenade ( metal ) was first worn as a cap badge. I know Kipling and King say from 1898, i believe this to be wrong. The Grenade was worn during the Crimea, on the albert cap/bonnet, however this may not have been metal. There are loads of photographs out there of Grenadiers wearing the Grenade and indeed the Pagri badge. Many of these photo's predate 1898. When i can i'll start posting some photo's.

Cheers Andy

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Andy - welcome to GMIC. I'm sure we will all be interested to see some of your early Grenadier badges, medals and pictures.

Anything to do with the Guards is of interest. Mervyn

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I hope these image links work, from my facebook account, I have a great interest in the Grenadier Guards, just a couple of things from my collection are a 1934 tunic and 1938 forage cap. I share it here as it is a rather nicely badged tunic, though I am sad to say the marksman and LG proficiency badges are replacements as the originals were crumbling, they have been preserved in cellophane to try to minimise further deterioration.

10561560_10152226883011519_7703166373965

10538078_10152226883071519_5513702313152

10329022_10152226883571519_4113167636218

10406532_10152226883581519_8573706576510

10444718_10152226883576519_5246818751648

Edited by SimonLMoore

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I hope these image links work, from my facebook account, I have a great interest in the Grenadier Guards, just a couple of things from my collection are a 1934 tunic and 1938 forage cap. I share it here as it is a rather nicely badges tunic, though I am sad to say the marksman and LG proficiency badges are replacements as the originals were crumbling, they have been preserved in cellophane to try to minimise further deterioration.

10561560_10152226883011519_7703166373965

10538078_10152226883071519_5513702313152

10329022_10152226883571519_4113167636218

10406532_10152226883581519_8573706576510

10444718_10152226883576519_5246818751648

Very nice, both are stunning, the scarlet looks to be in very good condition. Very good to see a forage cap from that period.

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