filfoster

Wasn't von Ribbentrop adopted by some noblewoman to give him his specious 'von'?

As to my original question: regimental uniform for generals was without the extra buttons worn on the general's blue uniform. Certainly the buttons were the same for field gray as for any other officer.

I make the Red Eagle without swords only because it's not distinct enough with the resolution I'm able to get on enlargement.

The first medal has no clasp. Any guesses that it's not the 2nd India General Service medal? I make the order: 1. Maybe India General Service? No clasp in photo 2. Crimea with Sebastapol clasp 3. China with Pekin and Taku Forts clasps 4. India Mutiny medal with Lucknow and Relief of Lucknow clasps 5. Ashanti medal Coomassie clasp 6. South Africa medal 1879 clasp 7. Egypt medal with Alexandria 11 July clasp 8. Victoria 50th Jubilee medal 9. Kehdive star 10. Turkish Crimean war medal The French Legion of Honor and Turkish Medidjie medal 5th class mounted above and over the Khedive Star and Turkish Crimea medals, which to my eye, is a very attractive complication and solution for an otherwise unwieldy long bar.

Mike: Thanks! This is a help. It doesn't conform exactly to the bar shown above (e.g., no Canada General Service for the Fenien Raid expedition), but both miniature bars together help confirm pretty much all the ones shown in the photo. I may be wrong about the Canadian medal; it wasn't awarded until 1899 and may not have been included in this bar. The photo, as far as I know, isn't dated. NOTE: The picture is probably circa 1895, which explains the missing Canada medal.

Last medal is the Turkish Crimea medal, following the Legion of Honor and the Medjidie?

Thank you! Can you tell if it's with or without swords?

Can anyone tell what the bottom order breast star is? Looks like a Prussian Black or Red Eagle to me.

Here is a display of his medals: What is the first one? His first posting was to Burma. This doesn't look like anything awarded for that (not sure anything was); is it the 1854 India General Service medal?: http://thisisalix.blogspot.com/2012/11/curators-national-army-museum.html

Do you have the URL for this? I have read several online and print bios and can guess at some of his medals but not all. The Wikipedia bio has a summary that allows guesses for the medals but it's not clear how these are presented on the bar in the photo. I was hoping someone had particular knowledge of this medal bar in the photo. The first medal is difficult to see.

Can any one identify the medals here?

Claudius suggests: "Hello; If you look closer, I think you will see that #2 is actually the Braunschweig Kriegsverdienstkreuz fur kombattanten. In that light, the precedence rules are properly followed. " I agree the Braunschweig medal conforms to the photo appearance but the 1915 Order of precedence would allow the #2 placement only if the officer wore a non-Prussian cockade. Mackensen was in Prussian service so wouldn't this violate the precedence? By the 1915 regulations that Braunschweig medal would go after the Centenary medal. If I make the wartime medal bar, even though I can't find a photo, I'd do this: 1.1870 EK2/ 2. 25 yr Long Service/ (alternatively, the 1916 War Service cross would also work); 3.1870-71 medal with clasps/ 4.Jerusalem medal/ 5. Centenary medal

I know the Kaiser was, at one time, hot de trot for this decoration. I remember reading somewhere that he insisted on its wearing by many officers to whom it had been awarded. Still an odd medal to choose. Your suggestion about the #2 medal may be correct; can't tell from the photos I see.

I enlarged this one and it looks like: EK2/War Service Cross/ ? / 1870-71 medal with many clasps/ Turkish Osmanie ?/ Centenary Depending on what the 3rd place medal is, it's still an odd display because of the next to last medal.

Thank you. It's still a very odd assortment of medals, considering what he could have chosen to wear. And how did he get the Southwest Africa gong? Accompanying the Kaiser as ADC? Isn't that medal often smaller? Could this be a Mecklenburg Military Cross of Merit? Also a strange choice to wear in preference to others he was entitled to.

EK2/Long Service/SW Afrika ??-how did he get that?/1870-71/?Saxe-Weimar White Eagle?/Centenary This seems to not follow the precedence rules.

Sorry for my confusion! Still, we are now at the same place: A six or seven medal bar and only the beginning and the end accounted for. Some hints at some of the medals: one near the end looks like a Turkish medal, the Order of Osmanie. Someone must be able to get a sharper focus on these photos. Would that foreign medal come before the Prussian Centenary? Wouldn't think so but.....

Revisiting this old thread. I am now trying to recreate this medal bar. It shouldn't be hard but it is, because, as the thread disclosed, there are no clear pictures of his medal bar, which probably changed as he acquired more gongs. Anyone interested in taking another crack at this? So far, only the 'bookends' seem accounted for: The 1870 EK2 and the Centenary Medal. The portraits hint at a lot of things and he had a wide choice. No Long Service? No 1870-71 Campaign cross? There's some weird medal, black or very dark ribbon with a complicated metal device on a ribbon bar. Can't place it. BTW, I'm not after his very late medal bar, already posted in this forum here:

Thank you both! It seems like this area would benefit from a good comprehensive reference with some color plates and photos. Evidently there is not yet enough interest to make it commercially attractive?

Does anyone know of a decently comprehensive illustrated guide to rank insignia of the Reggio Esercito in WW1? The Osprey offering is deficient in illustrating the rank insignia as is the Mollo WW1 book. There are a few, incomplete hits on Google. Specifically, what was the cuff rank and collar insignia for a Colonel in command of a Brigade? What colonel insignia was the three silver stars surrounded by gold embroidery? Molte grazie per le risposte.....

Thanks much for this. Although it doesn't answer the question of who first thought it needed to be done, it is very satisfying to see the regulation itself.

Still, some one individual first had the idea. That idea obviously found enough agreement to get it done. I think it would be fun/rewarding to identify who first had this idea, although I am resigned to the fact that it is probably lost to history.

It is still incongruous to me that in the midst of a world war, someone (still unidentified!) thought these added distinctions were necessary. The insignia for field marshals had included the same collar and shoulder cords as for generals since 1870, granting the collar patches began about 1900 and that many generals entitled wore regimental distinctions. The WW1 field marshals, when not wearing regimental distinctions, wore shoulder cords and collar patches in common with lower grades of general, but with the shoulder devices of field marshal. I hope someone can identify the father of this brainchild.

It'll be worth the wait. The Germans were so incongruous; fighting a world war but not too busy to create and amend uniform details that arguably didn't need to be done at all. I read somewhere that von Leeb was annoyed at the extra expense of changing these collar patches and shoulder cords. Clearly he wasn't the one lobbying for the sartorial enhancements.

I doubt there's any source for this information but it's amazing to consider. On the eve of a two-front, total war for the triumph (soon to be just survival) of the Reich, some particular individual of sufficient importance thought it necessary to add more gold to the uniforms of field marshals. Only the Germans! I do hope someone with better researching skills or at least a hunch and a better database can point to the someone we can credit this idiocy.