Veteran

Nice of you, Mike, to start with an opinion. I fully agree with your idea, and I rather hope the "pip" will be able to tell us a little more. The medal was unnamed, as issued. I have been wondering if the "pip" could not have been added some time after the campaign, possibly to remember a second lieutenant who could have been killed in that war, or could have died some time after. Best regards Veteran

Hello everyone This Crimea medal has a strange period ribbon : instead of a clasp it carries a "pip" sewn on the obverse. Could this pip be made to complete the story. I have never seen anything quite the like. Comments will be gratefully received. Thank you Veteran

Thank you fot this information about the "British, Belgian and French Agents" who were civilians and received a BWM as a reward for their help to British Military Intelligence. You are right they have been clearly listed and the register is at Kew. Contrary to what Alec Purves thought, their medals are all properly named (I have had two to Belgians and still have two to French ladies) with First name Initial and Family name : i.e.: L. VERFAILLES (French) or J.T. DE NEVE (Belgian). A few years ago, a post was made here about a Frenchman who had been shot by the Germans for the same type of services and who received a posthumous BWM, I believe. The BWM I was inquiring about is different : the First name (MICHEL) is fully engraved, which to my knowledge excludes the Agents. Thank you for your kind help.

Thank you both for your helpful answers. Paul, I had first thought that "all'Estero" meant "in foreign countries". But it could, of course, also mean "overseas". Your suggestion is a great help and makes better sense. No wonder, you are on the spot, as always. I am very grateful and this definitely wets my appetite. Jim, I found information through Google, but could not make much of it. It was kind of you to bring this. I just hope we have an Italian collector or connaisseur who will be able to comment on the medal more fully. The medal has been in my collection for decades and I never really thought about it. It seems time to wake up. Very best regards to both of you. Paul

Hell all Could anyone comment on this medal, obviously mounted to be worn by a lady. It is the silver Merit Medal for teachers in italian schools established in other countries than Italy. This is clear. The only reference I could find is Franco SCANDALUZI (Ordine equestri, Medagie e Decorazioni italiane 1962) who mentions a BRONZE medal with a RARE grading. The medal shown in the book is a V.E. III type with the facist reverse. This one is therefore prior to 1923 AND a silver medal. What is still to be established is its relative rarity and all other information which would help to understand its true nature. Further information will be gratefully received. Veteran

Hi Any man could have been confronted with a special combat situation at any time. Moreover, the MM was the only award available for at least 18 montns after the War started, until the Croix de guerre was created. As I tried to explain earlier, there was no set rules about progress in bravery awards, except possibly with the Air Force, where things could be codified to a point. In fact, I would say that most French collectors don't reason along those lines. Generally speaking, a MM to a man under 35 would always be considered an award for gallantry. An older man could also have one for long and distinguished service in the ranks. But he also could have received it for bravery. That is because the MM serves both as a gallantry and aa a long and distinguished service medal like the MSM (not an automatic award). The French approach to awards is different. Don't try too hard to compare it with the British or the German systems. Hope this helps.

Hi Chris I would rather think there was no "rule of thumb". Air force pilots would possibly receive a MM after so many palms if an NCO or be made a Chevalier of the Legion d'honneur. But normal Army or Navy personnel could receive MM or LdH with less than 5 citations. Outstanding bravery could gain an immediate MM or LdH with a palm on the croix de guerre. This happened to my own father. As a second lieutenant 2e Tirailleurs, during the very first days of the initial attack on Verdun February 1916, when the Germans were crushing the French defenses under an avalanche of artillery and delivering the heaviest attack ever, he rallied men who were falling back after all their officers had been killed, brought them forward and stopped the developping attack. He was very badly wounded during the fighting. Within a few days, he received an immediate Legion of honor + croix de guerre with palm published in the Journal Officiel. One tradition was that NCOs and enlisted men who had already won a Medaille militaire would receive the Legion d'honneur for a new outstanding act of gallantry. When on parade, the flag of the famous Regiment de Marche de la Legion etrangere was surounded by five NCOs and men who ALL had that combination, the bearer being a lieutenant with the Legion d'honneur. Naturally traditions have varied with the years. But they remainded pretty much the same durint WW2, Indochina and Algerian wars. Best regards Veteran

Hello Noor I agree with P. These medals are very popular these daya, partly because a very good book was published last year on the subject. Nevertheless such Colonial Medals of the early period do come on the market constantly. The professional offers are sometimes high, as is the case for the TONKIN medal shown. But they can also be cheaper : one early Colonial Medal with early clasp ALGERIE (mistakenly announced as AFRIQUE) is up for sale on the French eBay until to-morrow and still well under 10 Euro. It probably will make a little more, but I doubt it will go very much over 40 Euro, if that much. Let's see what the market says. Best regards Veteran

Hello Noor I agree with P. These medals are very popular these daya, partly because a very good book was published last year on the subject. Nevertheless such Colonial Medals of the early period do come on the market constantly. The professional offers are sometimes high, as is the case for the TONKIN medal shown. But they can also be cheaper : one ALGERIE (mistakenly announced as AFRIQUE) is up for sale until to-morrow and still well under 10 Euro. It probably will make a little more, but I doubt it will go very much over 40 Euro, if that much. Let's se what the market says. Best regards Veteran

Hi Prosper A very nice medal you have here. It is indeed a Mercier finish and the clasp too if you could see the maker's hallmark. Incidentally, the Mercier marks were first with M D C (the D in runing script) then M D C with a full D. Your ribbon is beautifully preserved and may have been awarded posthumusly. But ribbons were supposed to be renewed every five years when worn and it may simply be a clean one. I just love the old clasps which were changed to the simpler pinch-bar around 1913, since the number to be awarded made them very expensive as they were farmed out for finishing. The Paris Mint and the private makers all went to the pinch-bar reverse. Regards Paul

Thank you so much Michael. I am most grateful. So he was born in Britain (but was he a Briton ?) and he served a a young lad as a Merchant Seaman. I cannot help wondering where his parents came from. This was a fast and most satisfactory answer. Wonderful. Hope to be able to reciprocate some day. Very best regards Paul

Hello paddywhack The naming is just as mentioned. No other indication. Medals to Belgian & French agents of Military Intelligence NEVER have the full christian name. Only an initial. Therefore this medal is clearly not to one of these agents, four medals to which I have or have had. For some reason, the merchant sailors seem to have been listed elsewhere. Seems you have run into the same trouble I have. Thank you for your message. Veteran

Hello all I have a BWM named to CHARLES RENAUD, a very french sounding name. Possibly Canadian, French or Belgian ( or Channel Islands ?). This type of naming is usually found on medals to merchant sailors. The trouble seems to be with finding the reference with the National Archives. Would anyone have a clue. Every bit of information will be gratefully received.

A very interesting group you have here. I cannot help thinking that a Legion of honor officer's badge would point to a Brigader General or a full colonel at least. The combination with a US award might point to a high ranking British or Commowealth liaison officer with the French (Free French ?) and the Americans, although one would rather expect a Legion of Merit from them in such a capacity. It might also be that the Legion of honor was awarded to this officer for services other than military. One has to remeember that the French order is the same for military or/and civilian services. He could have been a high ranking embassy official with services before or after WW2 in Paris. Hope you find who the gentleman was. Lots of enjoyable research. Happy hunting .... (

Hello all ! These beautiful pictures show two kinds of orders, which the purist collector of French colonial material should clearly understand. One first group of five orders are proprely considered to be French colonial orders. They originally were Indo-Chinese or African, awarded by local rulers of countries which had been taken over by France in the later XIXth century, namely : The Royal Order of Cambodia The Order of the Dragon of Annam (one of the componants of now Viet-Nam). The African Order of the Black Star of Benin (West African country) The African Order of the Star of Anjouan (Small island in the Indian Ocean, off the East African coast). The African Order of Nichan-el-Anouar (Tadjourah a minute Sultanate on the Red Sea) These orders were simply annexed by the French and the Chancery of the Legion of honor was in charge of all five. The local rulers had practically no say. The first two were returned to the King of Cambodia and the Emperor of Annam shortly after WW2. The three others were dubbed "Overseas Orders" and continued to be awarded until they disappeared with the creation of the National order of merit along with a dozen other minor government "orders" in 1963. The second group of two orders were treated differently. Nichan-Iftikar of Tunisia and Ouissam-Alaouite of Marocco, although they were frequently bestowed upon Frenchmen, remained "foreign" orders whith close ties to the French. The Nichan-Iftikar disappeared when Tunisia became a Republic. The Ouissam-Alaouite is still bestowed by the King of Morocco. Rather confusing, of course. But these orders deserve to be understood as best as possible. Veteran

Hello Prosper Very nice picture indeed. To be absolutely exact, the two first medals are official issues (1939 Croix de guerre & Italian campaign medal). The third is not really a veteran's medal. It is neither a campaign medal nor an official one. It was an award made by "Rhin-et-Danube" the association for veterans of the French 1st Army (1944-1945) sometimes refered to as the African Army. They landed in Southern France with the VIIth Allied Army Group in August 1944 and finished the campaign in Austria in May 1945. This (private) medal was given by Rhin-et-Danube to members who have served the association with distinction for a number of years. The association was officially disbanded a few years ago when most of its surviving members had disappeared. Its is not rare, but you don't find it often. A nice addition to any WW2 French collection. Thanks for showing. Best regards Veteran

Jeff You might be interested to know that half-a-dozen projects including the picture on the left were submitted to the selecting board. The final choice proved very successful, although it was not particularly original (the Russian Order of Saint-Ann with swords was very much like it and had been in existence for decades). Thanks for showing. Veteran

Hi Noor You are right to assume that this may be the final part of a larger set of ribbons. These two probably were worn the other way round. First the green ribbon for the Tunisian order of Nichan Iftikar, then the red ribbon for the unofficial (but generally tolerated in veterans' groups) Verdun commemorative medal "awarded" by the City of Verdun. Happy collecting! Veteran

A very good start indeed. Since you have several frames, you might like to put all official war decorations in one of them, official civilian awards in an other and keep the third for unofficial badges, since you seem to enjoy collecting them as well. You would possibly derive even more pleasure when looking at them. Happy collecting ! Veteran

A very good start indeed. Since you have several frames, you might like to put all official war decorations in one of them, official civilian awards in an other and keep the third for unofficial badges, since you seem to enjoy collecting them as well. You would possibly derive even more pleasure when looking at them. Happy collecting ! Veteran

Your are right. In fact, the cross is one of the priviledges attached to the "Carte du Combattant" which intitles its owner to a very symbolic pension (it still does : I get a little less than 600 Euro/approx.800$ a year as a WW2 veteran) The "Carte du combattant" is a Government issue. One has to apply and prove he belonged for a long enough period to a combat unit, or have taken part in a certain number (3 I believe) of major battles. Men wounded in action receive it without other justification. Incidentally, the cross has to be bought (a few Euro) by the wearer. All the best Veteran

Hello Noor I would rather believe your badge to have been made in Tunisia. The enamel is quite typical, as is the silver body of the badge. A mint mark in Arabic might also be stamped in the back, but not necessarily. Quite my favorites... Regards Veteran

You are quite right. The Combattant Cross was created quite a few years after the end of the war. When you find them with the posthumeous awards of Legion d'honneur/Médaille militaire + Croix de guerre, the crosses have simply been added by the family : had these men lived, they would have automatically been intitled to wear them. Veteran