Veteran

Hello Chris The Paris Mint hallmark you show was used after 1913 on all products struck by this Government Agency. The numeral 1 simply means the silver alloy is 900/1.000 fine. From 1975 and later, a small star was added on all products. A regular stock was maintained for a very long time in order to furnish the required medals and clasps for legitimate buyers, whatever their motives were (they could have been elderly survivors, descendants of men and women who had earned them, or collectors of course). Jean Hass, whom I have known personnally, handled thousands of early colonial medals and clasps in his time, which was still quite close to the colonial splendor of the French empire. He therefore saw the more recent products as play material for collectors. Hence his judgement that the "stared" material was so recent it could only have been made to satisfy collectors .... who incidentally were not in sufficient numbers in the '50s to justify a special stricking. It may just be that the Mint went on routinely stricking after 1975 and for a few years using that hallmark. I certainly don't feel one should look upon medals and bars carrying it as mere "collector stuff". They are late official strickings, period. When I started collecting, in the mid-60s, I picked up what was left of the 3rd stricking of clasps for the Colonial Medal (1910-1918). No one was particularly interested and I got the lot at going price. Collectors were just not interested. So why would the Mint have started anything special ? I apologize for this long explanation. But I feel things are more straightforward than most collectors think. Regards Veteran

It might well be that the last ribbon (light blue with golden side stripes) is something else again. This group could have been worn by an field officer in the late 1940/1950s (Legion d'honneur + croix de guerre 1939 + commander Ouissam Alaouite) having served in the French colonies (I am sorry I could not read the bar on the m?daille coloniale). The blue and gold ribbon ribbon we are discussing is probably the Medaille d'argent de l'?ducation physique issued between 1929 and 1956. This is rather a younger man's award, possibly earned at an early stage of this officer's carreer. The Ordre du M?rite sportif was awarded during a short period of time, starting in 1956 and disappearjng in 1963 when the Ordre national du m?rite was created by General de Gaulle. Best regards Veteran

Hello The Turkish Order of the Crescent is like the Loch Ness monster : it does not exist but it reappears occasionnally. This time two pieces are beautifully displayed as part of the Spada Collection, to be seen at the Mus?e national de la Legion d'honneur et des ordres de chevalerie in Paris. One is a gold and enamels breast badge very similar to the "commander" badge I showed and the other breast badge sold in PARIS last year at auction, both previously mentioned on this forum The other is an embroidered breast star, the property once of Admiral Horatio, viscount Nelson, duke of Bronte, who received it after the Battle of the Nile. The breast badge is admittedly french manufacture. An other badge also is to be seen as a miniature with reduced-size stars of the russian orders of Saint-Alexander Newski, Saint-Wladimir and polish White Eagle. Possibly italian workmanship according to the catalogue. Regards Veteran

All these diplomas provide fascinating stories, reviving forgotten campaigns. Thank you for this well documented topic. Regards Veteran

Garth It looks very much like a privately cut caporal's uniform. The two short oblique stripes on the sleeve were the war-time rank (short for a double chevron). Such uniforms were sometimes worn by men who were assigned to HQ when they had the money to have them taylored. A "caporal" does not count as an NCO in the French rank system : he is an "homme du rang", a ranker. Seems he had a number of war-time chevrons on the upper part of the sleeve. I don't know what the Lorraine Cross stands for. Sorry I cannot be of better help. Veteran

Garth The painted metal version of the CEF (Corps Exp?ditionnaire Fran?ais) badge was worn in the traditionnal fashion on the breast-pocket of the tunic or shirt. Usual place for distinctive unit badges in the French Forces. Service cap badges reflecting the type of unit are mostly embroided. They are distinctive of the employment : infantry, cavalry, tanks, service corps or medical corps etc... Hope this proves helpful. Regards Veteran

Very interesting comments..... They certainly show how difficult it is to understand what was life in a period one did not live through personnally. Many who did are still confused about many events, if not most . It is hard to convey the state of ignorance one lived in and the amount of shear propaganda prevalent in those days. Situations can seem so cut and dry when looked at a few decades later.... With my very best regards Veteran

Hello KDVR A well made badge IIIrd Republic knight's badge as suggested by Great Dane. Silver and probably gold centers. Some chipping, but generally good condition. They are easily found in France where they can be picked up for 15 to 25 Euro, sometimes even less. Extremely well made luxury badges in pristine condition, from some of the best Paris jewelers, will draw a better price. They sell for more in other countries where they are less numereous. Regards Veteran

Hello Mark Great information about Col Waddell whose name appears often as related to the Regiment de Marche de la L?gion ?trang?re. I had not realised he was with the R?giment de Marche d'Afrique in the Dardannelles campaign. This was made up from one bataillon Legion + two batallions Zouaves. The nice group to Lieutenant de Boigne is worth seing. I could not find anything about him, but his family is still in existence, with several military men. Best wishes Veteran

Very nice group, Mark, espescially if it can be traced to its original owner. The stork was the badge of a very well known fighter squadron, "Les Cigognes", Capitaine Charles Guynemer was a member. You are right about the precedence of the Legion d'honneur over all other French awards since 1830. The exception being the very scarce award to a commander in chief who previously was a Grand Cross of the Legion d'honneur before the M?daille militaire was bestowed upon him. In that particular case, and only in that case, the M?daille militaire is the supreme French award. Best regards Veteran

I believe General Eisenhower also received the M?daille militaire as Commander in Chief, Allied Forces in Europe. Hope this is not mistaken Regards Veteran

Most certainly civilian. Worn on the coat lappel to show interest or participation in an orchestra, probably a band. Regards Veteran

Bonjour Fran?ois Very interesting message. I beg to differ on one point : the "Carte du combattant" is not automatically given to holders of a Medaille militaire. Conditions are 3 months in combat areas and/or taking part in five "combats class?s". This can be waived for men who were wounded in combat or received a "citation" (mention in dispaches) for gallantry. This would be the case for a gallantry award of the M?daille militaire. The M?daille militaire can also be awarded for exemplary long service, without any war experience at all, or with non-comabattant units (i.e. Medical Corps). In which case the Carte du Combattant is not given. Regards Veteran

The M?daile militaire is indeed a superior gallantry award. Several croix de guerre (=citation = mention in dispaches at various levels) were usually necessary before a M?daille militaire could be obtained for bravery. In some instances of great distinction in combat, an immediate M?daille militaie was given with an additional croix de guerre with palm. This is the top award level for a NCO or lower ranks. Repeated outstanding gallantry could even earn a Legion d'honneur for an NCO or other rank who had previously earned the M?daille militaire, which can only be bestowed once upon the same man. What complicates the matter is that the M?daille militaire is also a long service and outstanding conduct award after 15 years at least service, in peace or/and in war. All ORs don't automatically receive it and often more than 15 years services are required. Generally speaking, a M?daille militaire worn by any man under 30 with a croix de guerre with palm or a Valeur militaire with palm will have been awarded for extreme combat gallantry, or for very severe wounds received during a particular act of bravery. An older NCO with a M?daille militaire without the additionnal award of croix de guerre/valeur militaire with palm will probably be wearing a long and exemplary service award. I hope this leads to better understanding of thiese confusing uses of the M?daille militaire. Regards Veteran

Hello I fully support Hendrick's comments. Two additions : First group of 9 ribbons is post-1945 and clearly Indochina + Algeria. The last three "colonial" orders and decorations would rather indicate a senior NCO (adjudant / adjudant-chef) but not an officer, because of the M?daille militaire. Second group : Second World War + Algerian conflict. Unfortunately, the Colonial and WW2 Commemorative Medals don't have the clasps which would complete the information. My hunch is that the Colonial Medal would have the TUNISIE clasp and the Commemorative could also have AFRIQUE, ITALIE and possibly LIBERATION clasps. A long service set of ribbons, to someone living in French North Africa in the 1940-1950s who would have also seen service. Probably a professionnal NCO. Both sets are very convincing, no recent setups as sometimes seen on the "net". Regards Veteran

Hi Bob Did you eventually get the M?daille de la Reconnaissance fran?aise you wanted ?. If not, you could try the Paris Mint where they are for sale practically at cost + VAT. Greetings Veteran

I was refering to the horizon-blue commandant's uniform you showed. The pictures of my father are all kaki uniforms, although the ocre tint of period photographs does not show this up very much. The half-moon is clearly seen on its light blue background, but not the numeral 2. Also the tip of his fourrag?re worn unfolded with its end attached to the second button of his coat ("en bataille"). Sorry I could not furnish a better one Regards Veteran

A man who joined October 1944 received a "matricule" under 18.000

Paul Your remark about this german-born legionnaire is understandable. One has to keep two things in mind about the Foreign Legion. 1. When a man signs up for a contract to serve with that unit, his past is his own business. 2. No legionnaire whose original country (real or pretended) is at war with France has ever been sent to fight it. On the other hand, if he feels like doing so, he can volunteer. That again is his own business. When serving with the Regiment in 1944-45, the driver of the Jeep I was assigned to was German. He had served for 14 years with the Legion and been in the Reichwehr before that. He had fought the British and the Free French in Syria, the Germans in Tunisia. He was fighting the Wehrmacht again in France and did so as far as we went, the Aarlberg. No one would have dreamt asking him why he was there. A better war comrade you could not have ! LEGIO PATRIA NOSTRA. When dealing with this Unit, you can let your imagination go. But you will never know how right you are in your assumptions, except what the official papers say. That is also why you will never get the service papers of a legionnaire from the Legion. Only the man himself will furnish them or his descendants ... if they feel like it. That is also part of the contract. Happy New Year ! Veteran

Hello ccj Yours is the regimental unit number as worn with kaki uniform. I would rather say in use in the 1930s and during the first part of WW2 for Algerian and Tunisian Tirailleurs Regiments. The 2nd was my father's regiment in February 1916 when they were engaged to check the onslaught of the German Army North of Verdun. He was then a "sous-lieutenant". We have a picture of him in kaki uniform showing that the half-moon is added to the numeral on a light blue field, as it is the case for the "horizon-blue" officer's uniform shown by bab. Regards Veteran

Very nice ! British medals are easy to tell from the French-made replacements : they swivell around a vertical axis appended to the suspension. French-made medals are always soldered to the suspension. Jeff, you are right about MOST British medals awarded to foreigners being un-named. The WW1 Navy DSM were an exception, I have 2 - both to French naval ratings, The very few MM, DSM for WW2 which have been seen around were named when awarded to Frenchmen. I also have a military BEM to a French corporal, named. Thank you for sharing these very scarce medals when they are with their papers. Best regards. Veteran

Incidentally, Ralph's remark about the British awards would deserve additionnal developments. I have never heard of Free French troups (the 13the Demi-Brigade de la L?gion ?trang?re being one of the very first units to join them) receiving such campaign stars and commemorative medals. Veteran

Hello This is a strange mixture of genuine, possible, improbable and plain "write in and we sent the medal" stuf. Obviously someone who liked wearing badges. Sticking to the genuine would have made up a respectable group worthy of any old soldier's chest. I feel rather sorry when such confusion appears. But such is human nature. And this is a free world after all. Greetings Veteran

Very nice badge of an "Officier de l'Instruction publique", the higher grade as established circa 1866 by Napoleon III for wear as a decoration. This one seems to be gilt silver and emblished with glass or cabochon "fruit" to the laurels. As stated earlier on this forum, it was quite a distinction, for a long time the only award available with the Legion of honor at the top level and life-saving medals. In some instances, they could even be made in gold (eagle head hallmark) with small garnets or even rubies. You will have noticed that the enamel of the stems has disappeared in parts on both sides : these badges were worn extensively before 1914 and quite often at functions later on. The Officier d'Acad?mie and Officer de l'Instruction publique grades became Chevalier and Officier de l'Ordre des Palmes acad?miques later. They were called "Officiers" since, at the vey start of the institution by Napoleon 1st, they were honorable "officers of the French University system". Before Napoleon III, the badges were embroidered on the academic dress. Your badge is a very nice one indeed. Probably 1910-1960, possibly earlier. Regards Veteran

Sorry Bernhard I could not find an officer by the name of ROYER on the list of officers of the RMLE during the campaign in France & Germany 1944-45; the Regiment became the 3rd REI in July 1945, as soon as it was brought back to Algeria. He probably joined from an other Legion unit wheh the 3rd REI was refitted for service in Indochina, or as a replacement later during the campaign there. Congratulations to Chris for such a valuable M?daille coloniale document. They don't show up that often. Regards Veteran