demir

QUOTE (Ed_Haynes @ Mar 2 2009, 00:12 ) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Very nice! Thanks, Demir (and Rick). More information on the Edhem Eldem book, please? Hello Ed, The book was published on the occasion of the exhibition named Iftihar and Imtiyaz (Valor and Privilege) Ottoman Order and Medals organized by Turkish ministry of Culture and Garanti Bank between 28.9.2004-26.12.2005. The name of the book is Iftihar ve Imtiyaz, Osmanlı nisan ve Madalyalar Tarihi by EDHEM ELDEM sold during the exhibition. price app. USD 80.00. 528 fine paper pages with a lot of pictures of the military personel wearing order and medals + all ottoman medals,orders,bars etc. Best wishes Demir

picture 4 book: Ottoman Medals and Orders Documented History by Metin Erureten 1. Canakkale (Gallipoli), 2. Caucasus best wishes Demir

picture 3: Book: Iftihar ve Imtiyaz, History of Ottoman Order and Medals by Mr. Edhem Eldem 1st bar: Caucasus, 2nd bar: Sakarya (Turkish Independence war) 3,4,5 bars : Romania (Collection: Isa Akbas)

picture 2: Book: Iftihar ve Imtiyaz, History of Ottoman Order and Medals by Mr. Edhem Eldem from left 3rd ribbon bar : Palestine (Collection: Isa Akbas)

Gentlemen, In order to help to understand the old Ottoman Turkish Script on the Turkish medal ribbon bars I am posting 4 different pictures of the ribbon bars. Best wishes Demir Picture 1: Ottoman Medals and Orders Documented History by Metin Erureten first row: 1. Gallipoli 2. Liyakat medal 1332 3. Suez Channel (Sinai) second row: 1. Iraq 2. Caucausus 3. The Siege of Kut (was a major battle of World War I, now Iraq)

Gentlemen, Why do you think it is TWM ribbon. This is a black and white photo, it could be easily Iron Cross ribbon, instead of red it might easily be black interior with with white borders. And if it is Iraq bar (I am sure not Gallipoli/Canakkale) the ribbon is not TWM ribbon. Am I right? all the best demir

Gentlemen, Why do you think it is TWM ribbon. This is a black and white photo, it could be easily Iron Cross ribbon, instead of red it might easily be black interior with with borders. And if it is Iraq bar (I am sure not Gallipoli/Canakkale) the ribbon is not TWM ribbon. Am I right? all the best demir

Hello, I think it is Iraq. Please see the picture from Mr. Er?reten's ottoman medals and Orders page 253. They are: 1.Gallipoli 2. Liyakat medal 1332 3.Suez Channel (Sinai) 4.Iraq 5.Caucausus 6.Siege of Kut (was a major battle of WWI,now Iraq) Best wishes demir

Hi, Sorry, Above is the all I could say. Best wishes demir

Hello, I deducted LIYAKAT from the word SEGA KAT. It may be TARZ-I CEDID BUYUK IMTIYAZ because it was also known as: "SADAKAT ve SECAAT MADALYASI" ( awarded for Loyalty, Valor and Heroism - Medal). Still there is a spelling difference. In order to idendify it we have to see the picture. The color of the ribbon of Imtiyaz is half green half red. On the other hand, From the Carbinieri web page I found out that; Between 1897 and 1906 the Force was present on the island of Crete to maintain public order, to oversee the conflict between the Christian population against the Ottoman Empire, and to organize a local, efficient, impartial police force modelled on the Carabinieri structure. Carabinieri Officers also organized a police force for the Ottoman Government in Macedonia from 1904 to 1911. Gen. Cosma Manera was still a Major in 1917 (http://www.carabinieri.it/Internet/Multilingua/EN/MissionAbroad/ - para: 10 ) so he might have been a Lieutenant or a Captain during 1908. (Is he the same person because you mentioned Generals papers). My point is; if he was a Lt. or Cpt. most probably it was a Liyakat rather then Imtiyaz. Best wishes demir

Hello, It may be LIYAKAT medal. (If you have a picture it will be easier to identify.) The date on it is 1308 (1890). The date on the paper is showing the date of the document. The ribbon is red with green lines at the sides. Best wishes demir

Hello Great Dane, The Swedish government authorized the dispatch of a 200-bed mobile field hospital. During the war a total of 1,124 Swedish men and women served at the hospital in Pusan. They might have received the English version of the medal like the Danish as you mentioned. The Korean War Page gives the countries involved in the War as: (http://www.korean-war.com) Australian casualties numbered more than 1,500, of whom 339 were killed Belgium?s Korea Volunteer Corps (Corps Volontaires Corea) was comprised of 900 Infantry troops. Casualties 97 KIA 355 WIA Canada; Altogether 26,791 Canadians served in the Korean war and another 7,000 served in the theatre between the cease-fire and the end of 1955. WIA 1,558. KIA 516 Colombia ; Casualties 146 KIA 69 MIA 448 WIA Ethiopia furnished three 1,200-man battalions to the UN Command, beginning in June 1951 but only one battalion at a time. Casualties 122 KIA 566 WIA France; During this period 3,421 French soldiers were involved in Korea. Of these, 287 were killed in action; 1,350 wounded in action; 7 missing in action; and 12 became prisoners of war. Greece; 840 infantrymen of the Royal Hellenic Battalion arrived in Korea. Casualties 194 KIA 459 WIA Luxembourg sent a 44-man volunteer infantry platoon to Korea. Casualties 7 KIA 21 WIA The Netherlands 3.972 men served in Korea. 2.980 of those participated in the actual war. A total of 1360 men of the navy served in the Korean waters. Casualties 116 KIA 381 WIA New Zealand : a total of 1044 men were selected from among volunteers. Casualties 31 KIA 78 WIA The Philippines; throughout the war it contributed five 1,500-man Battalion Combat Teams. Casualties 92 KIA 356 WIA South Africa; 49 officers and 157 other ranks of 2 Sqn, all volunteers, left for Johnson Base in Tokyo prior to their deployment in Korea. During the Korean conflict the squadron flew a grand total of 12 067 sorties for a loss of 34 pilots and two other ranks . Casualties 20 KIA 16 WIA South Korea Casualties Killed in Action/Death: 137,899 Wounded in Action: 450,742 Missing in Action: 24,495 Prisoners of War (those returned from North Korea) 8,343 Total: 621,479 NOTE: These figure did not include the losses suffered by South Korean para-militia and police units Thailand ; contributed the 2,100-man. Casualties 136 KIA 469 WIA Turkey; The advance party of the Turkish Brigade or Turkish Armed Forces command, arrived in Pusan on 12 October 1950. The main body numbering 5190 troops arrived five days later, on 17 October. Brigadier General Tahzin Yazici commanded the brigade. Colonel Celal Dora was assistant Brigade Commander. Casualties 721 KIA 168 MIA 2111 WIA United Kingdom; 27th British Infantry Brigade (Aug 50-Oct 50, redesignated below)27th Commonwealth Infantry Brigade (Oct 50-Apr 51, HQreplaced by below)28th Commonwealth Infantry Brigade (Apr 51)29th British Infantry Brigade Group (Sep 50) Casualties 1078 KIA 2692 WIA USA; 33,741 US Dead, 23,615 Killed In Action,92,134 US Wounded** ,4,820 US Missing In Action (Declared Dead),7,245 Prisoners Of War,2,847 Died in POW Camp,389 POWs known to have been alive after all U.S. POWs supposedly returned. (**Lightly wounded who were treated and released back to duty are not included in these figures.) MEDICAL HELP Danemark; hospital ship "Jutlandia" India; a mobile army surgical hospital Italy sent its Itallian Red Cross Hospital 68. Norway; It had a hospital staff of 59 and administrative staff of 47. Sweden; The Swedish government authorized the dispatch of a 200-bed mobile field hospital. During the war a total of 1,124 Swedish men and women served at the hospital in Pusan.

Hello Elvis, Yes I have, but if you are a member of ebay there are some on sale now. These are original issues: UN United Nations Service Medal 1953 Korea NR (310122134575) United Nations Korean War Service Medal NR (400031694170) ORIG UN Korea Service Medal Campaign Medals Korean War (120379570268) check these, if you can not succeed I will be glad to send you one. Beware of the new ones like this one shown below, the difference is easy to see. Best wsihes demir

Dear Terry, You got a beatiful range of TWMs. Congratulations. demir

Hello, I think it is a Turkish type,paint long gone and a suspention ring added. But you can get one with the paint app. this price. Here is a Turkish WM for you to compare. Best wishes demir

Hello, I mentioned the Hong Kong person "yus18" before, now the Chinese "chinacoin" is selling fake Turkish Commerative coins in ebay: 400027731452, 400027731255, 390027406463, 400027730448, 400027730305, 390027405930 For your info. Best wishes demir

Hi, Now " cinare2006 " is selling "dursen51" s fake medals etc. Also, fake Turkish commemorative coins are being sold by Hong Kong and Chinese people. They are selling silver coins as bi-metal colored coins. They were successful and get app. USD 450 for each coin. I wrote to ebay but as usual I got some automated replies . Best wishes demir http://www.darphane.gov.tr/english/madeofoutside.htm

Thanks Avsar for the useful info. Demir

Dear Friends, You are all wellcome. I thank you all for your interest in Ottoman/Turkish medals. Best wishes demir

Hello, This is one of the earlier Service and Bravery Medals, although there is a special Crimean war Medal, according to Edhem Eldem (Book: İftihar ve İmtiyaz Ottoman Order and Medals History, page 139, pictures pages 149&150) this medal was also given to those British soldiers who were involved in the early stages of Crimean War (4 October 1853/30 March 1856); Silistre Castle Siege -Silistra town- on the Danube River by the Russians 14 April/23 June 1854 and on July/August 1854 Yergogu -Giurgievo-) There is also a Silistre Medal dated 1854. According to Mr. Eldem (page: 207): in the Ottoman document dated 14 May 1856; an order was given to prepare 220.000 certificates for the Military Duty Order of Glory Medals which were going to be presented to those Ottoman soldiers who fought in the Silistre,Kırım (Crimea) and Kars (another medal ) wars and soldiers fought in other wars. Additionally, in this document it was pointed out that, on the soldiers' certificates who fought in Silistre, Kars and Kirim, these places needed to be mentioned specifically. Whereas, it was denoted that, for those who were to receive the Order of Glory, it was enough to mention (on the certificates) that they had (only) served well in the army . Annex to this documents the amount of the medals were also given: Crimea: 60.000 , Silistre: 13682 Kars: 20.000 and General Service Medal (Order of Glory): 126.138 pieces. So, it is a little bit complicated. If they received special KIRIM, SILISTRE, KARS war medals , did they also receive Order of Glory. According to the Official document no . So the British soldiers who received the order of Glory must have fought other wars (like above mentioned Yerğ?ğ? battle) which was stated in the official document . But he also says that they received the OofG medals for Silistre war (Town by Danube river). So this is all I can say. Everybody received everything. Good for them and the Ottomans. Best wishes Demir

Hi, This is, as you say, İftihar Madalyası (Order of Glory) dated 1270 (1853). Sultan Abd?lmecid era. It is NOT CRIMEAN WAR medal. There is a CRIMEAN war Medal issued a year later 1854. There are 3 dies, Sardinian, British and French : La Crimea, Crimea and La Crimee. Please check the same web page you mentioned. ( http://www.turkishmedals.net ) The UNC and VG Order of Glory medals sell app. USD 150 in Turkey and they are easy to find. Best wishes demir

Hi JJ, This buckle also has the same script "Asakir-i Şahane" (Ottoman Army or Sultan's Army). Best wishes Demir

Hello, It has nothing to do with any "Movement" . A friend of mine who is also a collector read the both scripts. They are both "Asakir-i Sahane" (Ottoman Army or Sultan's Army) in different pattern and mold. Best wishes Demir ERMAN

Hello JJ, I am posting 2 pictures of Atat?rk. In these pictures he was wearing a War Medal other then J.H.W. ! I am sure that high status receivers did not get high quality "private purchase" versions of the award, everybody was awarded the official version, but later everybody have chosen the one they like. It was nice to present him a copy of J.H Werner. In the first picture he was sitting: in Halep (now Syria) dated 1917 while he was the Commander of the 7th Army under the Thunder Army Groups. (Although in the Atat?rk's Moseleum Museum the explanation under the Medal says that the medal awarded by the Sultan on 11.5.1918 OFFICIALLY ) The 2nd picture standing: while he was the Commander of the Thunder Army Groups (Turkish: Yıldırım Orduları Gurubu), replacing Liman von Sanders in Sinai and Palestine Campaign dated 1918. But as Mr. Avşar İbar says he has a J.H. Weber also ( A better looking medal comparing the others) but in these pictures he was wearing a normal TWM. note: For belt buckle collectors please check his buckle (picture below) Best wishes Demir ERMAN