Stijn David

Hello, Here is a better scan from the "Bandspange" => feel free to add more Cordial greetings,

Hello, A good question where multiple answers could be given, no all mighty answer for sure but as the Prussians did have the motto "Suum Cuique" !! Well for me a good consideration is that it is still possible (altough it is ending fast) to speak with the soldiers who where in that very war. As a example i do give with pleasure the following picture. The picture was a very first time published in my recent booklet "Verleihungsurkunden .... Cholsmchild", it is written in german as in order to give the veterans that did co-operate a understandable piece of what we can rediscover. The picture does show a bunch of "Luftlande" soldiers and before publication only 1 soldier was known towards me, namely the middle one as he did had this one in his Photoalbum. The publication was launched and within 1 month i did receive the names from both the left and the right soldier. In otehr words, they are now identifyed with name and also what happened with them is known now; left soldier : Uffz. Ottmar Fischer (he was KIA in a flying accident at Riga - 1943) right soldier : Uffz. Helmuth D?hne (he was KIA while acting in a Jagdgeschader in 1945) Without the publishing of this picture these would have been annonymous German luftwaffe soldiers, now these soldiers have their name back and their face is known towards me and you. Thats what is fascinating me so much, we can still find persons who did particpate and tell about it, so it has a historical value for me. Cordial greetings,

Hello, Thank you for comments and nice pictures of originals. Keep the following type identification about glider badges in mind, in a certain future the system will become more and more known Type I : C.E.Juncker Type II : Br?der Schneider/Wien etc .... Within this system there are subdivisions, etc ... but that will be clear after the launch of the bookproject on these. The fun thing is that for example within the BSW glider badges a wider range of metal types can be encountered ( for example, quite often persons do talk about Buntmetal, etc .. . but i can assure you that when analysed with SEM etc .. rather different compositions do come towards the daylight => in that way that the inner composition from copper, Aloy, etc ... can differ, resulting in a different metal look ) Anyway, glider badges are a fun thing to collect, however always keep in mind that it is a small minefield on its own but i am always illing to help the members of this forum to give info, hints, advise, etc ... Cordial greetings,

Hello, Thank you for he comments @ Stogie: It is Br?der Schneider / Wien instead of Bruno Schneider The very fun thing is that a German collector already had this one in his collection but was told by a few dealers etc ... that it was a fake => he returned it etc ... and the original owner did send it towards me for inspection. Needles to say i was very suprised to see a original pop up So you see, know your subject and you will find very nice original objects Cordial greetings,

Hello, Here is the reverse of this badge, it does show signs of repair => the catch has been repaired (as was broken of), one of the rivets (left one seems to have been flattened or repaired) and there are scratches on the reverse. Otherwise this badge is very nice, as i have never seen one in this condition i makes me wonder iff this could be reworked (= new finisch applyed) ? Any idea's + feel free to comment. Cordial greetings

Hello, Here is a unmarked BSW glider badge that i have the honour to look at, this badge is in a condition (certainly the front) that i have never seen before with these BSW badges. Absolutely stunning as far as i am concerned Cordial greetings,

Hello, This is absolutely terrible news, i wil make anouncement of this in the upcomming SKF newsletter + will post a link on our website towards this thread on our homepage. Hopefully the thieves can be caught and the medal bars recovered Cordial greetings,

Hello Humberto, Seems that this thread did not get the attention it does deserve, the so caleld "Hausorde .... HG" is a strange beast indeed. I have no acces towards my literature but iff not mistaking i think that there was a article on these in the Patzwall magazine. That can be found for sure on the website of Patzwall. As far as i do know it was a non official recognition from HG, he was after all very crazy about juwelery + keep in mind that such a thing was in earlyer times something that was rather for royal houses. In that way he was rather equal towards Napoleon. They both adopted certain symbols to create a myth arround them . For example: * Napoleon = adopted many symbols from Roman Times etc ... * Herm G?ring = he adopted also many symbols and in that it fitted to make a so called 'House Order", in that way he could use the system of awarding orders to get a certain shine and create a sort of medieval brotehrship. Very interesting when you think on this. Cordial greetings,

Hello, Thank you for sharing these more detailed pictures. very nice piece and we can only say towards the newer and olde rcollector => look at this one untill you go , this is the thing to look and learn from. This is the real thing and it is scarce for sure !!!, just imagine one had to survive more or less 50 close combat days, that was something for sure Is the former recipient known from this one? Cordial greetings

Hello, OOOHH indeed, i might be mistaking on this one => could you post a close up of the ribbon bar? That would make it clear iff it was either the ribbon for the "Galipolli Star" or for the Imtiaz medal etc ... (or even another exotic thingy ? ) Cordial greetings,

Hello, Karl gratz was awarded the following as far as i could find them: * Honour Goblet - as a Uffz. - date : 08.06.1942 * Knights Cross - as a Uffz. - date : 01.07.1942 - Unit: 8./J.G. 52 * German cross in Gold - as a Fw. - date : 08.06.1943 - Unit: 8./J.G. 52 De not be surpised that a KC was awarded before a German cross, these things did happen and is often seen with Luftwaffe personel. Hope this does help. Cordial greetings, ps: did just see that Doc already posted the info

Hi Robert, very nice picture for sure, the device as found on the ribbon denotes a battle (altough unofficial as far as i do know) and it depicts the ribbon for the Turkisch star as the soldiers where allowed to wear the ribbon on a ribbon bar and the star seperatly. Sometimes you do see a mounted star on a medal bar but that was a private arranged method of wearing. There was a nice article recently printed by the following community: http://www.ordenskunde.at Cordial greetings,

Hi Kevin, Thank you for the transliteration Cordial greetings, ps: do not feel shy to add anything towards this thread, it is a fun subject (at least IMHO )

Hello, Will try to add a bit towards our masters reading: - Evreux ; 28.03.1941 Cordial greetings,

Hello, ANd here is a closing written down diary report from such a Silver C holder. He was active in Afrika (Tunesia) and was lucky enough to survive and been drafter back towards Germany to start the officers course. He and some comrades where flewn back from Tunesia towards Italy in Ju 52 transport planes. During the flight over the Sea 2 of the Ju 52 began to play and did fly as close as they could + hit each other wings etc ... The flight guest did become nervous from this dangerous play and he did point out his Silver C as in order to get something to say against the pilot of the plane he was in. Effect was apparently that the dangerous game was stopped. " Ich konnte schon eine kleine Lippe riskieren, denn auf meiner sch?bigen Afrikajacke klebte das stofferne Abbild des "Silbernen Leistungsabzeichen f?r den motorlosen Flug" damals noch recht selten und begehrt " Mayby some native German can translate this in perfect Englisch? It does show that amongst pilots etc ... this particular badge was held in high regard !! Cordial greetings

Hello, The thing that Chris does say as told by his gandfather is 100 % accurate, the Silver C was a very high distinction at that very time. I can find and post other such evidence as written down by silver C holders. To make it more clear how difficult this one was to get at that time, * The shown second pattern document by me did belong towards a world record holder during 1938 in gliding. * Almost 90 % of the glider pilots involved in the Eben Emael mission where holders of the Silver C. * The glider pilots in the Crete assault where of the very same caliber, etc ... . * etc ... So iff you guys encounter such a thing, do look at it with respect Cordial greetings,

Hello, And as the goal is a informative thread offcoarse => here is the second pattern of the Silver C certificate. The personal details are hidden for the moment as upon recipients request Cordial greetings,

Hello, Thank you for the reaction Gary, indeed Detlev does state that there does exist a version with diamonds. He is correct in that but is mistaking into the time when these where awarded. The only official and awarded versions from 1932 towards 1943 are: A Profiency B Profiency C Profiency Silver C badge Gold C badge The Gold versions with diamonds are from after WWII, the reason is rather simple. After WWII the construction and materials of the glider planes did change so it did become needed to make a higher grade of profiency badge. So please Detlev if you do read this, take note of this and correct it in the book. All above named grades are indeed still awarded nowadays, you can distinguish the recent made pieces simply by the construction etc ... Also be aware that the pieces from during 1950's etc ... are exactly the same as their 30's and 40's counterparts when speaking of the A, B & C grade. The silver C has differences already. Here is a picture of a cloth version of the silver C in wear Cordial greetings,

Hello, Here are the conditions that one had to fullfill to earn that silver C, * 1x 5hrs flight * 1x cross-country flight covering 50KM of distance * 1x flight with the starting height risen of 1000m Cordial greetings,

Hello, In this thread there was also info on this subject, altough abit more hidden; http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=4883&hl= Attached is a original sample board from the company of S & L, we can see a comercial produced Silver C in the second row from the S & L production. Cordila greetings,

Hello, And here is a cloth version of the silver C from the collection. Cordial greetings,

Hi John, No problem => iff one does ask questions we can't learn + im always happy to help out when possible. There where approx. 2.000 Silver C awarded from 1931 towards 1943 (believe me, known numbers are lower then 2.000) , from this i have made already a breakdown and have found out at this very point that the following country's did hold a Silver C in the above mentioned period: 1.444 : Germany 208 : Poland 133 : Hungary 54 : U.K. 40 : France 31 : Switzerland 27 : U.S.A. And then we have multiple country's with a few silver C's earned More research is needed but once upon a time i will launch a (hopefully) nice article about this subject, with name listst, etc .... ps: we have to see this all in its context, after the 2 nd. WW aerial inventions etc ... did result in much higher performances of planes, etc ... and it has resulted that the Silver C is nowadays a much more easy to archieve award. But lets not forget that with the glider from before 1945 it was a hard to archieve award.

Hello, Nice one for sure, could this colourpatern simply be a enamelmistake? With this i do mean a wrong mix of colouring or to high heath during the enamelingproces resulting into a different endcolour. In older times when the mix of colours (mostly oxides used etc ... in those times ) was rather delicate + the proces of enemaling is a rather delicate one, we do know the examples of the Russian Saint-Anne with black enamel => that is also the result of the enameling proces where something happened that wasn't supposed to happen (certainly in the very old ones). I believe we do have the exact same in this very Bavarian MVO. Cordial greetings,

Hello, Here is a link towards a thread that has information on the subject - silver C http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=3523...amp;#entry36883 Post nr. 11 does show a original award document (there does exist 2 patterns of that one by the way - the shown example by Chris is the first pattern) for what is commonly known as the Silver C. The silver C award (correct German name : Leistungsabzeichen im Silber), in the 1930 & early 1940's this was a very hard badge to obtain, one had to fullfill quite a few conditions to earn it. And with the planes they used that was no piece of cake for sure. The numbers do speak for themselves - between 1931 and 1942 there where only about 2.000 awarded Iff someone does have a certain (glider)pilot that he does wisch to be checked - feel free to mail or PM me, as i have the complete list (once upon a time it will be published As depicted on the document, on had to fullfill 3 different archievements to get that one: More to follow ... ps: Iff someone does have a certain (glider)pilot that he does wisch to be checked iff he was a holde rof the famous Silver C - feel free to mail or PM me, as i have the complete list (once upon a time it will be published

Hello, Silver C?, did someone say silver C ? Cordial greetings,