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    arb

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    Everything posted by arb

    1. Having just read the guidlines for this forum, I realize I ought not to have commented on the postings, hence the modification.
    2. To add to the confusion, I'll provide numbers for 1870/71 published 1922 in "Vom Sterben des Deutschen Offizierkorps", p. 75 by way of comparison to the casualites of WWI Total strength of the German Army: 42,420 officers, doctors and Beamte 1,451,992 NCOs and other ranks Total strength: 1,494,412 KIA or died of wounds: 2, 264 officers, etc, 39,149 NCOs , etc for a total of 41,413 Wounded: officers etc 4,239 NCOs, etc 84,304 for a total of 88,543 Grand Total of casualties: 6,503 officers, 123,453 NCOs, etc for a total of 129,956 Andy
    3. I believe that the entry incorrectly spelled the name of the ship. There was an SMS Frithjof- have a look here http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_Frithjof Andy
    4. I would suggest that Dfr = Dampfer (steamer). The entry below Dampfer Bremen reads "Frittjof." Andy
    5. Thank you very much for the response to a three year (and three day) old post! The name and source are very much appreciated. Andy
    6. I think you may have two different officers. It is highly unlikely that an offier would rise from Sek.Lt. to Oberst in 18 years (with the exception or royals, of course.) The 1828 reprint (2nd edition) of the 1806 Rangliste (with the changes between 1806 and 1828 given)shows a Sek.Lt. von Watter in Regiment Zweiffel (Nr. 45), which until December 1805 was Regiment Unruh. It notes that Sek.Lt. von Watter left the army in 1806 as a captain. Also, there is no other officer named von Watter to be found in this Rangliste. Andy
    7. Dave, They were awarded between 1892 and 1912: 1892-1 1893-1 1894-1 1895-0 1896-1 1897-2 1898-1 1899-0 1900-0 1901-0 1902-2 1903-0 1904-0 1905-5 1906-4 1907-2 1908-2 1909-10 1910-12 1911-6 1912-9 Andy
    8. The bar dates from before 1895, when battle bars were authorized for the 1870/71 Medal. Either this fellow was an incredibly ancient retired army officer not decorated for either 1866 or 1870/71, or more likely was a young officer in both wars who went into the Gendarmerie. The Baden 25 was not given to officers in Baden military units after the treaty absorbing Baden’s forces into those of the Empire. I don’t have a Baden Court and State Handbook before 1902, so can’t say whether this quartet MIGHT be traceable to a Gendarmerie officer of circa 1890. Thanks to the owner for bringing it by to visit and to Andy for posting since I’m not online. Rick Research
    9. This is posted on behalf of Rick Research This was brought by for the final Traveling Museum gathering of 2010 to be Epsonized and shared with you all but especially Sascha. Lovely gold Baden Zähringen Lion Order-Knight 1st Class (BZ3a), 1870/71 War Medal, Baden Campaign Medal with (UNDER-mounted !!!) bars for 1866 and 1870-71, and Baden 25 Years Service Cross.
    10. This is posted on behalf of Rick Research This was brought by for the final Traveling Museum gathering of 2010 to be Epsonized and shared with you all but especially Sascha.
    11. Dave, Thanks for checking the names against the rolls. I'll let Rick know- this should send him back to the salt mines to find this elusive man! Andy
    12. If you are able to find the correct picture, I will provide the information to Rick, who will be happy for the additional information. Andy
    13. Posted on behalf of Rick Research One of the most commonly misunderstood aspects of researching anonymous Imperial German award groups is how rare COMBINATIONS of otherwise common awards actually were. Case in point, the prolific Great War numbers of Bavarian Military Merit Crosses (BMVKs with Xs) and Saxe-Meiningen War Merit Medals (SMM). With literally hundreds of thousands of the former (in the BMVK3X bronze classes) and almost 23,000 of the latter, neither of these awards could be considered rare. Individually. But how many SMMs were bestowed on NCOs, NCO-equivalent military officials, and privates in the Bavarian army? A grand (drum roll please) total of 293. None of those SMMs to Meininger “strays” in Bavarian uniform (as all were) went to Warrant Officers (Feldwebelleutnant and equivalent) who would have received a BMVK1X. Possible recipients of a BMVK2X only numbered 55—and here is a pair of ribbon bars to one of them— The 4 ribbon bar is in Prussian precedence (1920s) with dulled silver X device and faded Bavarian long service award in last place, while the lower bar (these came together from the same source) dates from during the war while in Bavarian uniform. Divided by rank, these potential “silver X” rankers were Wachtmeister-Offizierstellvertreter = 1 (listed as a regular) Feldwebel = 4 (all listed as regulars, meaning all would have had a Jubilee Medal 1905 or 1911) Wachtmeister = 7 (6 regulars—as above—and 1 dL probably no Jubilee Medal) Vizefeldwebel-Offizierstellvertreter = 4 (3 listed as regulars—as above—and 1 dL—as above) Vizewachtmeister-Offizierstellvertreter = 2 (1 a regular and 1 dR as noted above for Jubilee or not) Unterzahlmeister = 3 (1 perhaps a regular but 2 listed with civilian occupations so NOT regulars)j Vizefeldwebel = 21 (14 regulars, 3 dR, and 4 dL likely no Jubilees but regulars held long services) Vizewachtmeister = 8 (5 regulars, 2 dR and 1 dL as noted above) Offizierstellvertreter (without permanent NCO grade listed) = 4 Beamten-Stellvertreter = 1 (listed as a regular but this was a wartime temporary “generic” rank) Of those 55, 17 had their SMMs gazetted in the Bavarian wartime issues of the Personal Nachrichten. One of the VWms can be removed as a suspect since he was later a Lt dR with no long service award. None of the others had any other “foreign” awards gazetted in the PN, leaving only class of BMVK to reduce potential suspects. The senior 18 NCOs above would either have had a Luitpold Jubilee Medal and a long service award or a long service award, based on whether regulars or Reserve or Landwehr—probably 11 with a 1905 or 1911 Jubilee and long service, so that many can be deducted as “suspects.” 238 junior NCOs and men who would have received one of the bronze BMVK3X classes (of whom 99 were gazetted in the PN), by rank were as follows— Sergeant = 21 Unteroffizier = 70 Oberjäger = 2 Obergefreiter = 2 Gefreiter = 58 Privates in all branches of the Bavarian army = 85 Please bear in mind that of these 55 senior NCOs and 238 junior NCOs and privates, virtually every one who received ANY class of a Bavarian Military Merit Cross would have had that gazetted in the Personal Nachrichten, so pursuing each one of the 293 individually would result in further distinctions possible in BMVKs by classes with Swords and with or without Crown. (It has over 30 years since I’ve had access to the Personal Nachrichten—in the Library of the U.S. Congress, of all places!) Here is a gigantic home-made ribbon bar from the Weimar Republic era, for a non-career junior NCO or private: In Prussian precedence, this startling bar’s array of very ordinary common awards from states of the Empire with no apparent common service CAN be explained— If the recipient was a member of K.B. Infanterie Regiment 8 ,,Großherzog Friedrich II. von Baden.” 216 members of that regiment had Baden awards gazetted in the wartime PNs. 35 of 60 Zähringen Lion Orders were gazetted, for some idea of the likely proportion of awards NOT gazetted. After the war, its original wearer was back in “Prussian” territory, wearing his EK2 first. As a former-Bavarian, his BMVK3X came next (the gold swords must NEVER be taken to indicate a BMVK1X without proper context—gold swords devices were routinely used for correct bronze ones. These are of an oddball type only used on 1920s vanity veterans’ private purchase awards). Next his “hometown” SMM, then the otherwise “inexplicable” Baden Silver Merit Medal on MKFVO ribbon, and finally (he was a true warrior) a 1919-21 Silesian Eagle 2nd Class. So WAS this possible? Indeed— FIVE Meiningers (who received SMMs) strayed into the ranks of Bavarian Infantry Regiment 8— One was a Vizefeldwebel-Offizierstellvertreter who can be excluded as a “silver X” grade NCO. The other 4 were 1) Gefreiter Karl Böttner of 3rd Company, 2) Gefreiter Friedrich Dreßler of 6th Company (gazetted in PN), 3) Gefreiter Artur Jakob of 9th Company (gazetted in PN), and 4) Unteroffizier dR Christian Kallenbach of 9th Company It would be extraordinarily difficult to come up with any other “suspects” in the sort of miniscule specialist units (independent signals platoons, mountain mule sections etc) which had no “Inhaber” or territorial origin. It has always been a truism that the lower a soldier’s rank, the less likely he was/is to be decorated—especially lavishly. By contrast, a mere 5 SMM holders were Meininger “strays” in Baden units (all of them in Ers Inf Rgt 28), 1 was a Badener in Meiningen’s own Inf Rgt 32, and 2 SMM recipients from Baden were in Saxon units. So here we see “common” awards whose recipients can be, respectively, reduced to 1-of-44-or-less and probably-1-of-4… out of the entire Bavarian army! It all comes down to having complete Rolls transcribed. Source: Award Roll of the Saxe-Meiningen War Merit Medal, transcribed by me Potential sources for further research: The Bavarian wartime ,,Personal Nachrichten,” and Ancestry-dot-com’s Bavarian infantry records online. My thanks to Andy for posting this for me since I am not online. Rick Research
    14. Although in German, this excerpt from a 1913 book used at the Prussian "Kriegschulen" clearly supports Glenn's explanation: „Die Matrosen- und Werftdivisionen sind Mannschaftsdepots. Den Matrosendivisionen wird zur Besetzung der Schiffe das seemännische Personal, den Werftdivisionen das Maschinen-, Handwerker- und Verwaltungspersonal entnommen. Einen ähnlichen Zweck haben die Torpedodivisionen, die die Besatzungen der Torpedoboote und das Torpedopersonal der Schiffe stellen. Desgl. die Minenabteilung, Unterseebootsabteilung, Luftschiffabteilung und Fliegerabteilung. Source: Leitfaden für den Unterricht über Heerwesen auf den Königlichen Kriegschulen. Andy
    15. Dan, The Biblio Series on the PLM winners does not, unfortunately, include a photo of von Heynitz, nor do I have a photo of him. Andy
    16. Dan, You have a very nice grouping. The signature is that of Hans von Heynitz, commander of RIR 91 from 21.09.1914 until 20.08.1916. You'll be happy to hear that he was awarded the PLM on 03.12.1917. He was wounded on 30.11.1917 as commander of IR 92 (he was also serving simultaneously as the "Führer of 40. Inf. Brig.). He died of his wounds 09.12.1917. Andy
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