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    paja

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    Everything posted by paja

    1. Second Tank Brigade Medal, photos found here.
    2. Unfortunately it would be a hard job finding families who haven't lost loved ones in wars, especially in our region... The fact that Serbia lost around one-third of population in total and over half of its male population during the Great War speaks for itself.
    3. I've heard that story and considering what was going on in the southeastern parts of Serbia not only during WW2 but also WW1 I wouldn't say that's impossible. Two family members lost their lives during the Great War. One, infantry 2nd lieutenant, was shot by the Austro-Hungarian machine gun near Čevrntija at the age of 21. This happened in September 1914 during the Syrmia Offensive, a limited offensive across the Sava river into Austro-Hungarian soil. The other one was the young 2nd lieutenant's father, judicial lieutenant colonel. Bulgarian troops captured him in 1915 during the Serbian retreat and, according to the family history, buried him alive. I do not know were his remains found later but his name appears on the family tomb together with the following inscription "savagely killed by the Bulgarians near Jelašnica". Unfortunately I do not have more information regarding his death or service, just some basic info I dug up in the Military Gazette, and his personal file got lost or destroyed.
    4. Thank you Paul, I appreciate your effort! It would be nice to see those decorations together.
    5. Does anyone happen to have photos of this medal bar "accompanied by the corresponding awards"? Even though the medal bar can't be authentic that's still a very impressive set of decorations!
    6. The medal was made out of gilded bronze, its diameter is 36mm and it was worn on the pentagonal ribbon in colors of the Serbian flag. These ribbons seem to be pretty fragile as they are very hard to find in a decent shape, I'd say they are much rarer than ribbons for the 1913 Cross. The main producer is the same as with the Second Balkan War Cross, Huguenin Brothers. There are also examples made by Bertrand, I think they are scarce, don't remember seeing one for sale... Producer's signature is visible on the front side of the medal.
    7. What an amazing piece of history! Thanks for sharing photos of the bullet pendant with us. Based on the date the person to whom it originally belonged got wounded in the early stages of the short Serbo-Bulgarian War.
    8. First Balkan War Commemorative Medal was instituted on 31 October 1913. On the front side is Cyrillic inscription "ОСВЕЋЕНО КОСОВО" meaning "Avenged Kosovo". Bellow it - Sun with year 1912, Serbian Orthodox Monastery Gračanica (XIV century) near Priština and the war trophies, captured Ottoman cannon. On the back side is Serbian double-headed eagle with laurel wreath around it. On its leaves are names of places where the Serbian Army won some of the greatest battles in that war: КУМАНОВО, СКОПЉЕ, ПРИЛЕП, ЈЕДРЕНЕ, ВЕЛЕС, Н. ПАЗАР, ДЕБАР, ШТИП, ПРИЗРЕН, МРДАРЕ, БИТОЉ, СКАДАР, ОХРИД, СЈЕНИЦА, ДОЈРАН, ЉЕШ, ТЕТОВО, ДРАЧ, ЕЛБАСАН, ПРИШТИНА (Kumanovo, Skopje, Prilep, Edirne, Veles, Novi Pazar, Debar, Štip, Prizren, Merdare, Bitola, Shkodër, Ohrid, Sjenica, Dojran, Lezhë, Tetovo, Durrës, Elbasan, Priština).
    9. Well I suppose the painter had to shorten it little bit, otherwise it would not fit the canvas
    10. Greetings Egorka, Just a small correction that is the Second Balkan War Commemorative Cross. While the First Balkan War was war in which the Balkan nations finally liberated themselves from the centuries-long Ottoman rule, the Second War was fought between the former allies over territorial disputes. It begun with the Bulgarian attack against Serbian and Greek forces in Macedonia. Romania and the Ottoman Empire also got involved against Bulgaria whose government was forced to seek a truce in the end. Anyway nice looking cross, like most of them out there it was made by Huguenin Brothers, Bertrand's is slightly different. Around 30 years prior to those events another war was fought between Serbia and Bulgaria. Serbia was defeated and the 1885-86 Commemorative Cross is shaped the same way as 1913 Cross but it is black and the ribbon is black with red edges. In the War of 1913 Serbia was victorious and because of that the Cross is golden and the ribbon is the red with black edges, this contrast is of course symbolic.
    11. A portrait by Nikola Milojević from 1898. Medal bar is just partially visible but I think next to the "black cross" is golden medal with something that resembles Aleksandar's profile which can be seen on the King's Guard Medal.
    12. Now back to king Aleksandar, on this nice wedding photo we can see his medal bar. Like in some previous cases I believe it consists of: 01) Order of Miloš the Great 4th Class 02) Order of White Eagle 5th Class 03) Order of the Cross of Takovo 5th Class (can't say for sure based on the photo but I don't see what else could it be) 04) Order of St. Sava 5th Class 05) St. Andrew's Day Assembly Anniversary Medal (seems to me that the medal is not round) 06) King's Guard Anniversary Medal (vaguely visible head?) 07) 1885-86 War Commemorative Medal 08) April 1st Medal (what esle could it be?) 09) Red Cross Order He's also wearing stars of the Order of Miloš (its sash as well), Order of St. Andrew, Legion of Honor, White Eagle, Takovo and St. Sava.
    13. I found a decent photo of the general with medal bar here. Not all of the medals are recognizable but based on this photo I think it's safe to conclude his medal bar didn't look like the one attributed to him. Based on his uniform I'd say the photo was made post 1927 and, according to information I found online, he was retired in 1933 upon personal request. I think the medal bar on the photo also consists of 12 decorations, same as above, but some of them are different and the same goes for the order in which they are placed. Photo: 01) Order of the Star of Karađorđe (I checked, he also received Karađorđe with Swords 4th class, according to regulations it is suspended from the 2nd buttonhole) 02) Order of the White Eagle 5th Class (with swords or not? - 4th class suspended from the 3rd buttonhole according to regulations and 3rd class around the neck) 03) Unrecognizable medal, according to the order of precedence it might be Obilić or Petar I Coronation Medal but who knows. It certainly isn't St. Sava nor Yugoslav Crown (photo might be from the period prior to its institution but then again if he added it up later the medal bar would have 13 decorations) 04) Albanian Retreat Medal, 4th place vs 11th place above! 05) Medal for Military Virtues, not even present above and it's not very likely that he would have received it near the end of career as a two star general 06, 07, 08) Not recognizable, we can only guess 09) Red Cross Order, here in front of medals commemorating wars above in front of all medals 10) First Balkan War Commemorative Medal 11) Second Balkan War Commemorative Medal (looks like the medal itself is missing) 12) First World War Commemorative Medal Medal bar: 01) Order of the Star of Karađorđe 02) Order of the White Eagle 03) Order of the Yugoslav Crown 04) Order of St. Sava (He's wearing 3rd class on the photo so I don't think he would have been awarded with the lower class later) 05) Order of the Red Cross 06) Perhaps something foreign? 07) Petar I Coronation Medal 08) Charity Cross (not wearing it in the photo) 09) First Balkan War Commemorative Medal 10) Second Balkan War Commemorative Medal 11) Albanian Retrat Medal 12) First World War Commemorative Medal By the way it's interesting to see that the general was also decorated with the Order of St. Michael and St. George (Companion), Legion of Honor (Officer) and the Order of the Redeemer (Knight or Officer).
    14. And one more attributed to medical general Jordan Stajić. I first noticed it around 5 years ago, after that it appeared several more times on various Serbian auction sites, sometimes with decorations. I posted it once before on GMIC and we thought it's original but now I'm not so sure, I think it's not.
    15. One more thing caught my attention, it's not the first time I see medal bar with the "recipient's" name inscribed on the back side. Around 2 years ago there was one on ebay attributed to general Sava Grujić, the seller was from UK. Anyway here are the photos, I think it's not original and it certainly couldn't have belonged to general Grujić. One should be very careful when acquiring Serbian/Yugoslav medal bars, there are people out there who make them today out of the old ribbons or combination of old and new ones!
    16. Next thing, classes of orders. When we looks at the photos we can see that the king is wearing Takovo 5th class, so I presume he's wearing the lowest classes on his medal bar, Miloš 4th class and the White Eagle, Takovo and St. Sava 5th class. The description says White Eagle and Sava 4th class and Takovo "3rd Class Breast Badge, Type I". This kind of puzzled me but I think I've figured out what it might mean, provided that it's not a mistake. When instituted in 1876 Takovo Cross had 2 classes, worn around the neck and on the breast. In 1877 one more class was added, the grand cross, and then in 1878 according to the new law Takovo had 5 classes. The 5th class from 1878, 3rd class from 1877 and 2nd class from 1876 look pretty much the same. So "3rd Class Breast Badge, Type I" could mean 3rd class from 1877, but that can't be true, it makes no sense whatsoever. The painting I posted in the first reply gives us the answer about the classes and confirms what I just wrote. White Eagle and St. Sava on Aleksandar's medal bar are silver.
    17. Let's continue, I talked about decorations that shouldn't be on the medal bar but there are some that are missing, first of all Cross commemorating 1885-86 War. Earlier I wrote about the "three medals", my guess was that they are: -40 Years since St. Andrew's Day Assembly -60 Years of King's Guard -April 1st of 1893 We can see ribbons for the St. Andrew's Day Assembly Anniversary and April 1st but not 60 years of King's Guard. I might be wrong, that medal might not be the King's Guards Anniversary Medal but it certainly isn't Natalija or Draga. The king is obviously wearing 3 medals on his medal bar and that one, whether King's Guard Medal or not, is definitely missing. One more thing is very suspicious - the order of precedence. I know it was being changed occasionally, but the order of precedence seen on this medal bar is highly unusual and contrary to regulations.
    18. Interesting coincidence, I wanted to start this topic for a long time and when I finally did so I noticed "The Ribbon Bar Attributed to King Alexander Obrenovitch of Serbia" here: http://www.emedals.com/newly-listed/the-ribbon-bar-attributed-to-king-alexander-i-obrenovitch-of-serbia I think it's pretty obvious it can't be authentic, if we disregard how it looks like, the combination itself is impossible! Needles to say I've never seen any photo or portrait of the king with remotely similar medal bar... Here's the whole description: "Order of the Milosh the Great (1898-1903), 4th Class Breast Badge; Order of the White Eagle, 4th Class Breast Badge, Type I; Order of Takovo, 3rd Class Breast Badge, Type I; Order of St. Sava, 4th Class Breast Badge, Type I; Red Cross Order; Order of Queen Draga, Breast Badge; Order of Natalie, 1st Class Breast Badge, Type I; "Gold" Medal for the Proclamation of the Kingdom 1882; Medal for the Constitution 1893; and Medal for the Fortieth Anniversary of the Restoration of the Obrenovitch Dynasty 1898. Mounted in a contemporary court-style, original ribbon with hooks where the awards once resided, inscribed in handwritten black ink and in cyrillic script "Alexander I King of Serbia" on the reverse, 43 mm x 238 mm, light age soiling, near extremely fine. Footnote: The "Gold" Medal for the Proclamation of the Kingdom 1882 ribbon in the eighth position is exceedingly rare, as the medal was only awarded to the King and High Ranking Officials. Provenance: This particular ribbon bar, accompanied by the corresponding awards, was sold through Spinks & Son, Lot 502. This item comes with a copy of the auction page." -Let's start from the beginning, the color of the first ribbon seems too dark for Miloš. -On the 5th place we have ribbon for the 1st type of the Red Cross Order. I don't think it's very likely that he would wear the first type after 1898, another question is - could he have been awarded with that order while being younger than 6... On the photos and portraits from that period which I have posted so far in the topic he wears it on the last place. -Next two are very interesting, Draga and Natalija medals worn by a man?? Plus Draga ribbon looks more like a ribbon for the Star of Karađorđe... -I have never seen king Aleksandar with the Medal for the Proclamation of the Kingdom. The Law was clear, the medal was to be awarded to the king (Milan), MPs and ministers! I have a thing or two to add, unfortunately I'm in a hurry so I'll have to finish my reply later...
    19. According to information from Russian Wikipedia he also received the following decorations: OTTOMAN EMPIRE Order of the Medjidie 1st Class ITALY Supreme Order of the Most Holy Annunciation Order of Saints Maurice and Lazarus 1st Class Order of the Crown of Italy 1st Class PERSIA Order of the Lion and the Sun 1st class PORTUGAL Combined Orders of Christ, Aviz and St. James of the Sword
    20. One of the last photos of king and queen. Aleksandar is wearing sash of the Austro-Hungarian Order of St. Stephen. I think the general behind them is Lazar Petrović (Лазар Петровић), king's adjutant.
    21. During WW2 Germans kept the saber at the White Palace (Бели двор) located in the Royal Compound. After the liberation and confiscation of the property belonging to the royal family in 1947 the saber was given to the National Museum in Belgrade. There it was packed in a crate together with other objects, stored in museum's depot and forgotten about. Almost 5 decades passed before the saber was "re-discovered" during the 1990s. Aleksandar and Petar II with saber.
    22. One more incredible saber kept at Oplenac. It was presented to Aleksandar Karađorđević on September 21st 1920 in Sarajevo by Smail-aga Ćemalović and Atanasije Šola who lead the delegation from Mostar. The saber is decorated with gold, silver and brilliants and it was made by "Doder Brothers" (Браћа Додер). Inscription on the blade: "Краљевићу Ослободиоцу - Вјерна Херцеговина 1920" or in English "To Prince Liberator - Faithful Herzegovina 1920". Names of the places where the most important battles of the Serbian Army took place during wars of 1912-1918 are inscribed on the scabbard. Source: Mr. Branko Bogdanović's article published in Politikin magazin few years ago
    23. This photo was made in 1896 during visit to Serbian Orthodox Monastery Hilandar on Mount Athos. If I'm not mistaken king is wearing Ottoman Imtiyaz Order (Al-i İmtiyaz Nişanı) and two medals above medal bar, perhaps Golden and Silver Imtiyaz Medals. I have a photo of his father (1898) wearing two very similar medals, we presumed they are Imtiyaz Medals. It's interesting that Turkish officer on the right is wearing Takovo and White Eagle. It's possible that the one on the left if wearing Takovo 1st class but I'm not sure. We can see some familiar faces among king's adjutants, I'm pretty sure the general is Dragutin Fransović (Драгутин Франсовић) who was minister of war at the time. Besides him future vojvoda Živojin Mišić (Живојин Мишић), Ilija Ćirić (Илија Ћирић) and Mihailo Rašić (Михаило Рашић). Unfortunately I'm not sure about others... Senior officer in the right corner looks very familiar, does anyone recognize him?
    24. Two more portraits from 1894 and 1895, the king is now wearing 3 more stars, Takovo, St. Sava and Montenegrin Order of Danilo. Also he's in general's uniform, not a colonel's as above.
    25. Here's one more very interesting one, perhaps made at the same occasion. I'm pretty sure that's Order of St. Andrew below Legion of Honor. Perhaps he's wearing that order's sash as well. I have found him among the recipients on Russian Wiki page.
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