Soviet Russian Name translation help needed!

[Gerd Becker]

Hello Gentlemen,

can anyone help me with this name and unit on this warsaw document?

Thanks in advance

regards,

Gerd

[Albert]

Hi Gerd,

Long time no hear.

"Private Kotsjuba, Pavel Nikanorovich"

"21st Separate Guards Rifle Brigade"

Signed by

"Hero of the SU"

Guards Major General

Muzykin

Best regards,

Albert

[Gerd Becker]

Hi Albert and thanks a million Not very much time for the hobby lately unfortunately

Tausend dank nochmal

Gerd

[Guest Rick Research]

Actually his dad's name was Nikandr-- so it's Nikandrovich.

21st Independent Order of Suvorov Pechentsky Red Banner Rifles Brigade. Whew!

Here's what Steen has on Muzykin:

http://www.generals.dk/general/Myzykin/Mik...viet_Union.html

The 13 February 1947 command will add a bit to the general's details. Do you have this unit in your Orders of Battles volumes Gerd? I'm curious as to what an Independent Guards Rifles Brigade DID-- and where. tt SEEMS a "step down" for Muzykin as a former divisional commander, so I wonder if THIS "brigade" was more important, somehow.

[Albert]

Actually his dad's name was Nikandr-- so it's Nikandrovich.

Oops, Rick is correct; the patronymic indeed is Nikandrovich.

Edited September 11, 2006 by Albert

[Gerd Becker]

Actually his dad's name was Nikandr-- so it's Nikandrovich.

21st Independent Order of Suvorov Pechentsky Red Banner Rifles Brigade. Whew!

Here's what Steen has on Muzykin:

http://www.generals.dk/general/Myzykin/Mik...viet_Union.html

The 13 February 1947 command will add a bit to the general's details. Do you have this unit in your Orders of Battles volumes Gerd? I'm curious as to what an Independent Guards Rifles Brigade DID-- and where. tt SEEMS a "step down" for Muzykin as a former divisional commander, so I wonder if THIS "brigade" was more important, somehow.

Thanks, guys.

Rick, unfortunately the Independent Brigades or Brigades in general aren?t covered in the volumes, i have. They are mentioned sometimes in the Divison Histories, but not listed seperatly.

Gerd

[Gerd Becker]

Hello all,

could someone please help me with this name and stamp on a Prague-Document? Got it today with a wonderful Type 1 Medal.(Thanks Andreas )

Thanks in advance

Gerd

[NavyFCO]

The 13 February 1947 command will add a bit to the general's details. Do you have this unit in your Orders of Battles volumes Gerd? I'm curious as to what an Independent Guards Rifles Brigade DID-- and where. tt SEEMS a "step down" for Muzykin as a former divisional commander, so I wonder if THIS "brigade" was more important, somehow.

I bet that this Brigade was actually the size of a "real" Brigade, vice the "real" regimental-sized divisions that he commanded during the War. I don't have this unit anywhere in any of my OOBs (or at least the ones I can find!) so I'm guessing it was probably made up post war. Perhaps one or even two divisions were rolled into it.

Dave

[Albert]

Hi Gerd,

Junior Sergeant

Rodchenkov, Semjon Il'ich

made out by

Glinkovskij rajvoenkom (=> entspricht in etwa unserem KWEA)

signed by some Captain, whose name I won't even try to read as it starts with Ag and ends in ~~~~

BR,

Albert

Edited September 14, 2006 by Albert

[Gerd Becker]

Thank you, Albert. I owe you.

all the best,

Gerd

[Albert]

My pleasure Gerd,

I looked at the Nikandrovich / Nikanorovich guy again. Not really sure now. First I thought its Nikanorovich, after Rick's post I fugured well it's probably Nikandrovich. Now you brought the thread back up and it made me look at it again...

The "d" in Nikandrovich looks too much like the "o" in the same name to be a "d". Also the "d" in the word "rjadovoj" (private) which was written by the same hand looks like your more typical "d" and not like the "d" in Nikandrovich; if it is Nikandrovich. Another thing is that Nikandr really is more archaic than Nikonor (also, even though more rarely, spelled Nikanor) which can be encountered even today.

Oh how I love the American printed-style handwriting

Best regards,

Albert

[Gerd Becker]

Albert, thats exactly the problem i encounter, when i try to translate these. I am not sure about some of the letters and as i have not very much experience with russian names, the results are very bad. You obviously have much more experience with russian names. Do you speak russian? If so, where did you learn it?

Sometimes i envy the people from the former east, who had russian in school and probably heard much more russian names in school and at all.

My skills with this language don?t progress very much, until i am able to start with a class on the VHS, which only begin in January here.

Thanks again, my friend.

Gerd

[Albert]

Albert, thats exactly the problem i encounter, when i try to translate these. I am not sure about some of the letters and as i have not very much experience with russian names, the results are very bad. You obviously have much more experience with russian names. Do you speak russian? If so, where did you learn it?

Sometimes i envy the people from the former east, who had russian in school and probably heard much more russian names in school and at all.

My skills with this language don?t progress very much, until i am able to start with a class on the VHS, which only begin in January here.

Thanks again, my friend.

Gerd

A BA, a MA, and an almost PhD (had to redefine life at "abd" level) in Slavic studies; plus teaching Russian for a couple of years... Spent a semester in St. Petersburg and two in Kiev. That's only the formal training part .

Edited September 14, 2006 by Albert

[Gerd Becker]

A BA, a MA, and an almost PhD (had to redefine life at "abd" level) in Slavic studies; plus teaching Russian for a couple of years... Spent a semester in St. Petersburg and two in Kiev. That's only the formal training part .

Teaching russian? Are you prepared for an online-course?

Thats great, Albert. I really wish, i would have done something with Languages too. I?ll have to go with a class at the local VHS, especially as my time is limited. But i will give it a try. And if i see, that my abilities with the russian language are limited, then i hope, at least the teacher is a good looking 28 year old russian brunette

[Ed_Haynes]

Envy you Albert! Have enough trouble with my few languages (mainly South Aasian) and my recent efforts to pick up some Mongolian.

You mind if I post a few for your reading pleasure? My colleague in Russian history grows grumpy when I ask him too often!

[amyagkiy]

Oops, Rick is correct; the patronymic indeed is Nikandrovich.

Unfortunately you wrong...the first translation was correct the letter "д" is being written differently in this document. Also, I have never heard of the name Nikandr and I'm russian... sorry.

[Albert]

Unfortunately you wrong...the first translation was correct the letter "д" is being written differently in this document. Also, I have never heard of the name Nikandr and I'm russian... sorry.

Well, in that case I am right Please, read the rest of the thread too; there is more reg. this issue.

However, you are wrong: There is a Russian name Никандр, it is archaic, as written above, and derived from a saints name like the rest of the ones from this family of names (see also Nikon). Peasants often used such "liturgical" names.

Ты посети поисковые сайты, наверняка найдешь многое об истории этих древних имен. Но я с тобой полностью согласен, что это именно Никанор, как я первоначально и писал. Меня сбил уважаемый коллега и тот факт, что Никонор чаще всего пишется через "О" а на доке Герда через "А". Да Бог с ними, этими "странниками и отцами Никонорами". А то, что ты русский, это ничего, даже хорошо

Удачи,

Альберт

Edited September 15, 2006 by Albert

[Gerd Becker]

My skills are a little better now, but still not good enough to be sure about the name in this document. Could someone please translate the name of this gent?

[matteti]

My skills are a little better now, but still not good enough to be sure about the name in this document. Could someone please translate the name of this gent?

Senior Lieutenant Voyi..... Pietr (Petr) Iosifovich

I cannot make his last name. Sorry.

[Albert]

My skills are a little better now, but still not good enough to be sure about the name in this document. Could someone please translate the name of this gent?

Hi Gerd,

Looks like Vojshnits, Petr Iosifovich (dt.: Wojschnitz, Petr Iosifowitsch)

Best regards,

Albert

[Gerd Becker]

Thanks a lot to you both. That was a tough one. I didn?t came further than the Senior Lieutenant Petr Does his rank correspond with his rank on the photo? I am not familiar with 1940?s Uniforms so well.

Thanks again

Gerd

[Guest Rick Research]

Yes, Petr Iosifovich Voishnits the way I'd spell it.

His rank is indeed Senior Lieutenant (3 squares) but NOTE: the tabs have PIPING, not gold bullion edging. He is not called "Poiltworker" so apparently not a commisssar, but a "technical" or "engineer" officer with those in front of his rank title.

[Gerd Becker]

Yes, Petr Iosifovich Voishnits the way I'd spell it.

His rank is indeed Senior Lieutenant (3 squares) but NOTE: the tabs have PIPING, not gold bullion edging. He is not called "Poiltworker" so apparently not a commisssar, but a "technical" or "engineer" officer with those in front of his rank title.

Thank you, Rick. Strangely the "sqares" seem to be rectangular. What is the difference?

[Ferdinand]

Hi Gerd,

Here are the emblems on the collars for the different ranks (pre-1943):

Enlisted men - none

Junior Sergeant - 1 triangle

Sergeant - 2 triangles

Senior Sergeant - 3 triangles

Sergeant-Major - 4 triangles

Junior Lieutenant - 1 square

Lieutenant - 2 squares

Senior Lieutenant - 3 squares

Captain - 1 rectangle

Major - 2 rectangles

Lieutenant-Colonel - 3 rectangles

Colonel - 4 rectangles

Or in pictures:

Private, Junior Sergeant, Sergeant, Senior Sergeant, Sergeant-Major:

Edited June 11, 2007 by Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

Junior Lieutenant, Lieutenant, Senior Lieutenant, Captain, Major, Lieutenant-Colonel, Colonel: