German Tunics Currently for Sale

[Mark M]

Two weeks until the MAX show and look what get lists for sale. These are all currently kisted for sale on Evilbay. How would you decide?

First, a Bavarian M10:

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[Mark M]

Here is a link to this listing for those interested

http://cgi.ebay.com/WWI-GERMAN-BAVARIAN-M1...1QQcmdZViewItem

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[Mark M]

Next up is a nice Prussian Kleiner Rock.

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[Mark M]

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[Mark M]

Here is a link to this listing:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...bayphotohosting

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[Mark M]

A nice early Saxon 20th (?) Regiment m1907/1910 Atilla.

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[Mark M]

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[Mark M]

Here is a link to this listing:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...bayphotohosting

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[Mark M]

AND, if those were not enough, the last one listed is a field grey general majors tunic from Mecklenburg!

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[Mark M]

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[Mark M]

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[Mark M]

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[Mark M]

And here is a link for this listing:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Ext-Rare-Mecklenburg-G...1QQcmdZViewItem

Like I said, I'm glad I don't collect tunics!

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[Kev in Deva]

And here is a link for this listing:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Ext-Rare-Mecklenburg-G...1QQcmdZViewItem

Like I said, I'm glad I don't collect tunics!

Hallo Mark, at least the guy selling the: Ext Rare Mecklenburg General Major Field Gray Uniform managed to include some very good pictures of the tunic.

Did you notice on: WWI GERMAN FIELD GREY KLEINER ROCK UNIFORM COAT. SUPURB

WWI GERMAN PRUSSIAN COAT W / IDENTIFIED SHOULDER BOARD Auction the seller managed to include in the picture his toes Clean feet promote a good sale

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...bayphotohosting

Kevin in Deva.

Edited September 15, 2006 by Kev in Deva

[Mark M]

Kevin

I did see the two toes in the bottom of the one photo but I couldn't tell if they were attached to anything or not!

Regards, and happy bidding!

Mark

[Stogieman]

I doubt very much the authenticity of the Mecklenburg General's tunic. Call it a "gut reaction"...

[dwmosher]

Mark:

Although interesting, all have some problems. The Bavarian foot artillery officer's M-1910 waffenrock appears to have had his collar replaced at some time and I can't see any blue flecking in the boards, although it has the proper white piping. If there is, I still could not find a corresponding Bavarian unit for this number (only three Bavarian foot artillery regiments and I couldn't find a either a line or reserve 15th Bavarian foot artillery battallion). The Kleinerrock appears to be legit for GR 3, but condition is a little less than desired with mothing and corroded buttons. For the attila, the seller has added to his description indicating most of the items that are wrong with the tunic. However, this is definateley not an officer's attila, and most certainly not for the Royal Saxon Hus. Regt. Nr. 20. Here is the braiding on a correct one.

Detail of braiding

Lastly, IMO the Mecklenburg genaral's waffenrock is a put-together from an M-1910 simplified tunic. A genaral's pattern tunic should have breast pocket flaps (although I have seen VERY FEW without them in contemporary pictures) and sewing of the collar tab shown is poorly done.

Regards

Dave

[Mike Dwyer]

...Lastly, IMO the Mecklenburg genaral's waffenrock is a put-together from an M-1910 simplified tunic. A genaral's pattern tunic should have breast pocket flaps (although I have seen VERY FEW without them in contemporary pictures) and sewing of the collar tab shown is poorly done.

Regards

Dave

Dave,

I'm probably way off on this, but don't the epaulettes on the Mecklenburg generals coat look kind of small? I notice on all of the other coats the epaulettes come very close to the collar, but on the general's coat there's 5 miles of open territory!!

Edited September 16, 2006 by Mike Dwyer

[Daniel Murphy]

Here's my 2 cents. The Bavarian foot artillery uniform has the wrong boards and a (newly?) replaced collar. The kleiner rock has some mothing, is wartime made and does not have the nice thick cyphers seen on pre war uniforms. It is probably the most correct overall. Everything looks right including the Berlin maker. The attila is enlisted and not saxon, but a decent piece. The Mecklenburg Generals uniform is not. The insignia on the collar appears to have been removed from another uniform and handsewn onto this one. The same is true for the boards. I also find it hard to believe that a Mecklenburg general would have his unifoms made in Wuerttemburg.

Dan

Edited September 16, 2006 by Daniel Murphy

[dwmosher]

Mike:

Aside from the other "issues" with the Mecklenburg general's tunic, you were right-on about the size of the boards, relative the the size of the tunic. Although the boards look legit, they certainly didn't start off on this tunic...

Daniel:

I agree that the attila is a decent piece, but I would not pay top dollar for it based on the incorrect cuff frogging and the incorrect shoulder straps. Just my opinion.

Dave

[Mark M]

Dan/Dave

Let me ask a question about the frogging on the atilla. You both clearly state that it is not a Saxon piece. While I agree that Saxon frogging should have green flecking, some do not. Paul Sanders in his reference books The Uniforms and Accoutrements of the Imperial German Hussars, illustrates a named and dated tailored Lt atilla from the 20th that has no flecking in the frogging (pages 208 to 210). The only green flecking is in the toggle buttons and rossetes. Both of the added sellers comments are from Marshall Daut, who was one of the pioneers in field grey German uniforms, who supports this belief. No one is disputing that the tunic hasn't been screwed with, I'm just wondering how you can be so certain it isn't when it sounds like this particular regiment used both styles of frogging?

Mark

[dwmosher]

Mark:

I know Marshall Daut, I know the history of the early 1910 Husar Rgt. Nr. 20 officer's attilas and I have seen Brian Sander's Saxon officer's attila up close. However, based on the rossettes, the toggles and the frogging on the back of the skirt and collar, I still believe the tunic on e-bay is a private purchase enlisted attila. As an enlisted attila, you can make it into whatever regiment you like, including any of the three Saxon attilas if you have the right straps for them. Everyone is entitled to his opinions, and even if it is what it has been proported to be, in my mind, the attila would be what a fellow collector would call a "Ricky Ricardo" item...."Lucy, you got a lot of esplainin' to do...", which means you have already lost ground if you want to sell or trade it in the future.

Regards

Dave

[Hun Helmet]

And here I was just checking them all out on ebay before coming here. I know next to nothing about German WWI dress. Must be someone selling off the junk to go buying at MAX.

Mike

[Chip]

Dave.

That's a great way to evaluate pieces and to collect. I have been using the Ricky Ricardo test all these years and didn't know it! Making the mistake of ignoring such problems seems to be a right of passage that most collectors have to go through. It seems like common sense to realize, that questions now will be questions later. It's too bad that the ABC's of collecting aren't a required course.

Chip

[Stogieman]

Gentlemen, always remember... the instant one has to start explaining....... the piece no longer has real value or historical significance.