France French ribbon bar with "France" clasp

[webr55]

I have had this ribbon bar in my collection for some time, however French bars are not my area. Can anyone help me what this ribbon with a "France" clasp is?

Chris

Edited November 11, 2017 by webr55

[webr55]

This one:

Edited November 11, 2017 by webr55

[Dave Danner]

M?daille comm?morative fran?aise de la Guerre 1939-1945 (French Commemorative Medal of the War, 1939-45)

Edited June 2, 2007 by Dave Danner

[PKeating]

That is the French 1939-1945 War Medal ribbon: Le M?daille Commemorative de la Guerre de 1939 - 1945. There were various theatre clasps authorised for the medal, of which FRANCE is one.

PK

[webr55]

Very fast, thanks. So am I correct that this is someone who fought in WW2 and got into the Fire Service?

[Veteran]

This clasp was earned by all members of the French Forces during the 1939-40 campaign in France (Phoney War and May-June disaster). It also went to some Allied troups, such as the Polish Army in France.

Rather a sad clasp for those men to wear, but a number of them had fought well and deserved recognition.

Veteran

[PKeating]

Indeed. But they could wear the FRANCE clasp with pride, in view of the severe damage they inflicted on the Wehrmacht, in spite of being appallingly badly led. Here's a group to quite a highly decorated soldier with the INDOCHINE clasp on his 1939 - 1945 ribbon. It is missing from his full size medal. He was one of the French soldiers in Indo-China throughout the Japanese occupation. This man also fought there in the 1950s. Note the small type Colonial Medal, often described as the Free French issue.

PK

Edited June 2, 2007 by PKeating

[Hendrik]

... the INDOCHINE clasp on his 1939 - 1945 ribbon...

Hello PK,

To my knowledge and unless I'm mistaken, the INDOCHINE clasp is not part of the series of official clasps for the 39-45 Commemorative Medal. For WW2 in those parts, an EXTREME ORIENT clasp existed, same as on the Colonial Medal.

Here's some more clasps for the Commemorative Medal (the AUTRICHE (Austria) one being non-official !) :

[Hendrik]

[Hendrik]

[Hendrik]

[Hendrik]

and finally, the dated bars :

Cheers,

Hendrik

[PKeating]

You're absolutely right. However, some of the veterans who served in Indo-China during the war put these Indochine bars on their medals and a blind eye seems to have been turned to the practice. No Indochine clasp was authorised, as you say, but like the Autriche clasp, they were tolerated. Some of the French personnel in Indo-China were pro-Vichy while others were Free French.

Following the 1940 Armistice between France and Germany, French Indo-China was very much out on a limb. On 30.8.1940, Japan signed the Matsuoka-Henry Pact, permitting Tokyo to station troops in Indo-China. The French waited until 22.9.1940 before ratifying this "treaty". The following day, Japanese troops shelled Haiphong to intimidate the French administration and the Thai government. There followed more bullying by the Japanese until Vichy finally signed an agreement after Pearl Harbor, effectively ceding authority in Indo-China to the Japanese although the French remained nominally in control.

In March 1945, the Japanese dissolved the French administration and encouraged the Emperor Bao Dai to declare Vietnam independent. In April, Laos declared independence, followed in May by Cambodia. Of course, they were nothing but Japanese puppet states. On 13.8.1945, the Indochinese Communist Party, led by Ho Chi Minh, staged a revolution. And the rest is history...

So that Indochine clasp represents an interesting time in the history of France. Of course, Paris had difficulty recognising loyal service by military personnel there because Indo-China had remained, nominally at any rate, pro-Vichy throughout the war but the benefit of the doubt was extended, given that French soldiers stationed there hadn't had much of a choice! So no clasp was authorised but clasps were worn and tolerated. I believe that General Salan wore one of these too.

PK

Edited June 3, 2007 by PKeating

[Hendrik]

... some of the veterans who served in Indo-China during the war put these Indochine bars on their medals and a blind eye seems to have been turned to the practice.

I agree, the French do on occasion display the "Nelson touch" ...

Paris had difficulty recognising loyal service by military personnel there because Indo-China had remained, nominally at any rate, pro-Vichy throughout the war but the benefit of the doubt was extended, given that French soldiers stationed there hadn't had much of a choice! So no clasp was authorised but clasps were worn and tolerated.

Indeed the situation there was somewhat complicated and muddled as can be deduced from the INDOCHINA clasp that was authorized for the Colonial Medal :

- first instituted on 18 March 1936 to replace the existing TONKIN, COCHINCHINE and LAOS ET MEKONG clasps

- revived by Vichy France on 13 September 1941 for war operations between 6 September 1940 and 28 January 1941 mainly against the Thai invasion of northern Cambodia and the Japanese landing at Hanoi and Haiphong

- abolished by the Free French in 1944

- restored on 2 February 1949

The EXTREME ORIENT clasp is more straightforward : instituted on 5 August 1946 for opposition to the Japanese attacks and capture of the French garrisons of 9 March 1945 (service period 9 March - 23 September 1945) and to the Ho Chi Minh led Vietminh rebellion.

Cheers,

Hendrik