France Vichy Croix De Guerre

[Tim B]

Hello again!

More questions as I try to manage my way through the French minefield.

I have seen two varieties of the French "Vichy version" Croix De Guerre and wanted to know if both are acceptable and if there is a timeline difference or if one is more scarce than the other?

I have seen both reverse styles on regular CDG's, so maybe the answer is more generic than I think. Another case of different manufacturers???

Thanks!

Tim

[Hendrik]

I have seen two varieties of the French "Vichy version" Croix De Guerre and wanted to know if both are acceptable and if there is a timeline difference or if one is more scarce than the other?

I have seen both reverse styles on regular CDG's, so maybe the answer is more generic than I think. Another case of different manufacturers???

Hello again Tim,

I think both are likely to be genuine.

Various styles do exist and note also the hilts of the swords are touching the cross on the one and not on the other of your crosses. Such differences are in my opinion due to several manufacturers, both in France itself but also in the then French colonies, producing these at the time.

Veteran and Bison, to name but those two, are far more experts on this than I am and I hope they will chip in with their opinions ...

Cheers,

Hendrik

[Tim B]

Hendrik,

Okay, thank you for that and hope others will comment and maybe show their pieces as well.

Tim

[TacHel]

Tim, when I first started collecting French ODMs I almost gave up, like you mention it, it's quite the minefield at first.

Check this web site, although in French, it is quite complete, actually, it is most probably the best web site on the subject anywhere.

FRANCE PHAL?RISTIQUE

The webmaster is Marc Champenois, he really knows his stuff and will gladly answer any question you might have.

Cheers!

[Tim B]

Yes, my heart was always with the German pieces, but prices are just too insane and some of these French ones can get addicting as well.

Okay, many thanks and I'll check this site out!

Thank you!!

Tim

[PKeating]

There is another type as well, which appears to have been struck on the same dies as the cross on the right. The central medallion with the larger dates is similar but has a rounded '3'. These "large date" crosses are said by some students of the subject to have been produced in French Africa, which was under Vichy control at the time of the abolition of the 1939 CdG and the introduction of the 1939-1940 CdG.

The 1939-1940 CdG, along with the 1939-1940 Croix du Combattant, was part of general policy reflecting the official line that the war between France and Germany was over. The cross on the right is scarcer than the type on the left with the normal, small dates. The Vichy government produced one official CdG during the war: this was the type with the single date '1944' and the Francisque instead of the Marianne on the obverse, with the legend "Etat Fran?ais".

It is important to note that a veteran wearing the Vichy-issue CdG was not necessarily pro-Vichy. I have a cross in my collection to a motorcycle scout with an artillery unit who was awarded it on 27.6.1940, several days after the armistice. It is a classic Vichy cross like the one on the left, with the small dates, but on a "Republican" ribbon that seems to be of British manufacture.

The citation is divisional, meaning that the Cannonier motocyclist d'?lite Pierre Ursault would have had a silver star on his ribbon. He may well have worn a silver star on the Vichy-approved ribbon but when he framed his document and cross with a new "Republican" ribbon, he obviously didn't have the star to hand. Such citations were vetted after the Liberation to weed out any CdG handed out like candies by obliging commanders to undeserving cases as France fell apart in the summer of 1940. Pierre Ursault evidently satisfied the scrutineers and deservedly so.

PK

[PKeating]

Vichy Croix de Guerre. Left: 1939-1940 "small date" cross with the rare variation ribbon. Centre: Vichy's only official Croix de Guerre, dated 1944. Right: 1939-1940 "small date" cross with the classic ribbon.

The black and green ribbon is sometimes said to be a subtle reference to the ribbon of the medal for the Franco-Prussian War of 1870-1871 and France's defeat, in other words, a subtle display of national mourning. As for the Etat Fran?ais CdG, it was instituted early in 1944 by the P?tain government. Being a purely military award, members of the Milice and other paramilitary and security organisations were ineligible. By that stage, the only soldiers eligible for this award were members of P?tain's personal bodyguard, the Groupe de Protection, and the 1st Regiment of France, a purely Vichy unit raised in 1943 when P?tain envisaged rebuilding the French Army, which angered Hitler. The 1944 Vichy Croix de Guerre was awarded for combat against partisans of various resistance groups and their SAS and SOE comrades. According to contacts here in Paris, there are several recipients known to be still alive.

It is believed that no more than a hundred, perhaps far less, were awarded before the eventual collapse of the Vichy regime in August 1944 and the flight to Germany, making this cross as rare as or perhaps even rarer than the fabled Croix de Guerre L?gionnaire, instituted in January 1942 for members of the L?gion des Volontaires Fran?ais contre le Bolchevisme fighting on the Eastern Front, which, although approved by the Vichy government, was not an official award, which is why those lovely examples one sees bearing the hallmarks of the Paris Mint are to be avoided. The LVF cross was privately commissioned and produced by the firm of Arthus Bertrand, who, according to a friend who happens to be a scion of the family, still have the dies, although they are in a very deep, dark place indeed and highly unlikely ever to be put to use again, unlike various German dies.

The London-based French Committee for National Liberation (Comit? fran?ais de la Lib?ration Nationale) passed a motion outlawing Vichy awards on 7.1.1944, actively implementing it as soon as Paris was liberated in August 1944. The Etat Fran?ais CdG, the LVF CdG and the various other unofficial CdG produced by General Giraud and General Juin were all abolished, along with other awards like the Vichy Croix du Combattant, the Ordre National du Travail and so on and so forth. As you can see, many of those in possession of a 1939-1940 cross simply changed the ribbon.

PK

Edited May 1, 2009 by PKeating

[PKeating]

And now for something slightly different but remaining within the Vichy theme. The crosses on the top are the Croix de Guerre des Th?atres d'Op?rations Exterieurs - Croix de Guerre TOE - for overseas campaigns. Top left is a standard French-made example from the early WW2 period. Top right is an North African-produced example and awarded to a Senior NCO in the 2? R?giment des Tirailleurs Morocains - literally "Moorish Riflemen", a colonial infantry regiment from North Africa. The interesting thing about this is that the 2? RTM was pro-Vichy and was dissolved in 1944. So this is can be said to be a Vichy Croix de Guerre TOE.

Note the differences between the Marianne heads. The Marianne on the North African-made cross differs from the French Metropolitan-produced cross. This type of head is sometimes described as an indication of African manufacture. As a footnote, the 2? RTM was reformed in 1947 and sent off to Indo-China. The winner of the this cross went with them. I have some of his stuff, from his grandson, including his Drago-made cigarette lighter with the regimental badge in enamels on one side and the map of Indo-China on the other. The original "Vietnam lighter"!

Bottom left in the above picture is the Republican 1939-issue Croix de Guerre as awarded during the 1939/40 campaign in France, before the armistice. This type, and the 1939-1945 type produced the Paris Mint are really the only official WW2 CdG. Next to it, you can see the round '3' "big date" Vichy-issue cross to which I referred earlier. It hangs from a Republican ribbon, indicating that the recipient's entitlement was upheld by after the Liberation.

[PKeating]

Reverse:

[Tim B]

Prosper,

Many thanks for an always very informative and enlightening read! Spectacular collection!

I have the type of cross on the left (both regular Republican 1939 and Vichy 1939-1940) and wasn't sure of the style on the right, but do see them on regular Croix De Guerre and wanted to ask. Many thanks for this infomation.

Tim

[PKeating]

A pleasure, Tim. Expanding on the scrutiny to which recipients' awards were submitted after the Liberation, it should be noted that the Vichy government also subjected awards to scrutiny after the armistice as a result of veterans' outrage over the liberal awards by some French generals, who had even suggested that any French soldier who had not surrendered when the armistice was proposed should receive the Croix de Guerre.

The pro-Vichy L?gion fran?aise des Combattants, one of the paramilitary veterans' associations set up after the armistice, organised a court of honour comprising veterans and serving officers or, rather, soon-to-be-demobilised officers. To tackle the problem, which was seen as a devaluation of the award, the court proposed the abolition of the 1939 CdG and the introduction of a new type, this being the 1939-1940 CdG. Anyone wishing to wear a CdG awarded between the end of the Phony War or Sitzkrieg on 10.5.1940 and the end of hostilities had to apply for the new version, thereby submitting himself to scrutiny. Wearing the 1939 cross was a punishable offence.

So, in conclusion, the 1939-1940 CdG was not as 'political' as one might presume. It was quite a radical solution to the perceived problem of relaxed award criteria. Many veterans of the War of 1939-1940 who joined the LVF or branches of the Wehrmacht proper wore their 1939-1940 CdG on their German tunics with pride. If some Germans were offended by this or by the sight of WW1 Croix de Guerre and other medals, they had to grit their teeth and bear it because it was all part of the grand charade of Franco-German 'Cooperation'.

Now, where is Ren? Chavez, who could tell us about the Giraud crosses and perhaps show us one from his collection.

PK

[Tim B]

Thought I would finally sit down and photograph a couple of the French medals I had so I can contribute a bit more than just asking questions.

Here are two Vichy medals; the 1939-40 Croix De Guerre w/palm and star and the Vichy Croix Du Combattant. I had to darken it a bit to show the light blue or the ribbon would like a black/white ribbon. Enjoy!

Tim

[Tim B]

Playing...

Croix de Guerre:

[Tim B]

I understand this is what is referred to as the "official" type with the smaller date and narrower annulus.

[Tim B]

And the Croix Du Combattant which is fairly scarce.

[Tim B]

Mint marked and "BR" for bronze on the lower arm. Enjoy!

Thanks again for all the help and excellent information!

Tim

[Cartaphilus]

Dear friends, I have a question about the Vichy War Cross:

Was this cross awarded for military actions made between 1939 and 1940 also? Or only was awarded for bravery acts between 1940 and 1944 (after French-German armistice)?

Thanks for your answers.

[JapanX]

I believe this is the answer

The pro-Vichy L?gion fran?aise des Combattants, one of the paramilitary veterans' associations set up after the armistice, organised a court of honour comprising veterans and serving officers or, rather, soon-to-be-demobilised officers. To tackle the problem, which was seen as a devaluation of the award, the court proposed the abolition of the 1939 CdG and the introduction of a new type, this being the 1939-1940 CdG. Anyone wishing to wear a CdG awarded between the end of the Phony War or Sitzkrieg on 10.5.1940 and the end of hostilities had to apply for the new version, thereby submitting himself to scrutiny. Wearing the 1939 cross was a punishable offence.

Cheers,

Nick

[Cartaphilus]

Very interesting. This means War Crosses awarded between 1939 and 1940 were replaced by the new Vichy Croix de Guerre. Is this correct?

If so, for what reason was replaced the original War Cross 1939, the new Vichy Croix de Guerre? Was this necessary?

Greetings