DavidM Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 HelloI have just received a cased EK1, and although I have a couple of EK1 I've never had a cased one before. However, my question is can anyone help with identifying the maker of this cross. I have seen the beading pattern on this cross before and just can't place it. In particular it's the pattern on the outer points of the beading that rings a bell, but unfortunately, as I say, I just can't place it. Sorry the scans aren't the best, but thats all my aging scanner can produce for me. Can anyone help ?Thank you.RegardsDavid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidM Posted November 30, 2005 Author Share Posted November 30, 2005 Closer in shot of beading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave B Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 Hello David,The cross is made by Rudolf Souval.CheersDave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn R Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 The corners of the beading have a Souval look about them, but I believe that another maker has a similar feature. Just combing my archive of photo's see what I can find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave B Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 The corners of the beading have a Souval look about them, but I believe that another maker has a similar feature. Just combing my archive of photo's see what I can find.Yep true,although the core has the usual small 1939.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidM Posted December 1, 2005 Author Share Posted December 1, 2005 HelloThanks for the information.RegardsDavid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn R Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 Thanks Dave. Not so hot on my Souvals! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Garvy Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 (edited) That does not appear to be a Souval hinge, in my opinion, although more than one manufacturer utilized that unique frame style with rounded inner corners and those pointy cornices. Interesting cross. . . Edited December 1, 2005 by Bill Garvy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave B Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 That does not appear to be a Souval hinge, in my opinion, although more than one manufacturer utilized that unique frame style with rounded inner corners and those pointy cornices. Interesting cross. . .I think Souval had two style of hinges Bill,I'm not 100% on that as I don't collect Souvals.....I'll check.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Garvy Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 (edited) I think you've touched upon the reason I, and I suspect many other collectors for that matter, have stopped collecting Souval Iron Crosses, becasue there really seems to be no way to tell period manufactured crosses from post-war restrikes. Be that as it may, I still have a couple in my collection that I shall post here for comparison. By the way, David, I was not aware of the two different types of hinges utilized by Souval, so thank you for that valuable information. I would be most interested in seeing an example of the other type than I have posted below. . . Edited December 1, 2005 by Bill Garvy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Garvy Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 Here is the reverse of the above cross with its broken clasp, sigh, and what I thought to be a typical Souval hinge assembly. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave B Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 Here Bill check this link out,it shows the other style hinge http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/iron_cross...s/l_58/l_58.htm Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Garvy Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 (edited) Thank you, Dave! Any idea which type is period manufactured or post war manufactured, or are both considered genuine of period issued crosses? Edited December 1, 2005 by Bill Garvy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidM Posted December 1, 2005 Author Share Posted December 1, 2005 HelloFirst of all thanks to all for their replies.Bill, I have been and looked at the Souval crosses on the WAF and I have found some examples which match mine and some which match yours. Both appear, by the members on the WAF, to be considered wartime production. The only post war production one I have found has a very thin pin, more akin to the 57 re-issue crosses. Hopefully for both of us this will prove to be correct and that these crosses in this thread are in fact war time production.RegardsDavid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave B Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 Thank you, Dave! Any idea which type is period manufactured or post war manufactured, or are both considered genuine of period issued crosses?I believe that both styles of hinge are considered wartime and as David says the thin 57 type is the postwar version.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Baker Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 Dave,Weren't there a few different cores thrown into these frames as well??Seems like I read somewhere that Souval might have sold the frames to other makers. That might also explain the different hinge styles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave B Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 Dave,Weren't there a few different cores thrown into these frames as well??Seems like I read somewhere that Souval might have sold the frames to other makers. That might also explain the different hinge styles.I've read that as well Jim mate!Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Garvy Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 For example, here is a "23" maker marked Iron Cross in 1st Class. Note the rounded inner corners, sharp cornices, and low "1939", although the swastika is quite well defined. In my opinion this has a similar frame, but a different core. Secondly, why do we assume this style frame was manufactured by Souval? Couldn't they have just as easily purchased the frames from some other manufacturer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Garvy Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 (edited) Here is the maker mark under the pin. . . Edited December 2, 2005 by Bill Garvy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Baker Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Hi Bill,I suppose they could have, but didn't Souval continue to crank out this frame after the war?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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