Canadian Forces Decoration

[Hauptmann]

Hi all,

Well, I don't know if this is like a one time deal or if I'm dipping my toes into Canadian awards... haven't decided yet. But this is one award I've always thought was beautiful and well designed. Plus being partial to gold it's a natural. And the case is an added bonus.

Without further ado, here's my newest acquisition... coming from Canada but hoping it'll arrive within the next week or so.

Also, all the photos are from the seller:

Stephen Weatherby

Gorg Sales (Antiques)

Truro, Nova Scotia, Canada

And used with his very kind permission.

Named to CPL. C J Boulegon.

Does anyone know how difficult/how much it would run to get the matching miniature and ribbon bar for this award?

As always all comments and any additional info are deeply appreciated.

Dan :cheers:

Edited June 16, 2009 by Hauptman

[JPL]

Hi all,

Well, I don't know if this is like a one time deal or if I'm dipping my toes into Canadian awards... haven't decided yet. But this is one award I've always thought was beautiful and well designed. Plus being partial to gold it's a natural. And the case is an added bonus.

Without further ado, here's my newest acquisition... coming from Canada but hoping it'll arrive within the next week or so.

Also, all the photos are from the seller:

Stephen Weatherby

Gorg Sales (Antiques)

Truro, Nova Scotia, Canada

And used with his very kind permission.

Named to CPL. C J Boulegon.

Does anyone know how difficult/how much it would run to get the matching miniature and ribbon bar for this award?

As always all comments and any additional info are deeply appreciated.

Dan

Hi Dan,

Nice court mounted CD with the case. The actual medal looks a lot nicer than the image you posted.

The CD is awarded for "12 years of service", but yours has an additional bar denoting 22 years of service (additional bars are awarded for each additional 10 years of service). Therefore, the ribbon bar will have one rosette in the centre of the ribbon.

Here is a link to the Canadian Forces medal website which has additional information on the CD:

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhr-ddhr/c...-eng.asp?ref=CD

A miniature should set you back about $15 Canadian. If you do a google search for: canada miniature medals for sale

you should get some sources.

Jean-Paul

[TacHel]

The "CD", or "12 years of undetected crime" medal as we jokingly call it.

Looks like an older model, good for you. The newer ones are from a different maker are soooo cheap! Molded instead of coined, and poorly finished. You can see file scrapings on the side, the ribbon hole is so small the ribbon barely fits through it and the bars don't even properly fit to the width of the ribbon!

I used to court mount medals and the new CDs drove me NUTS!

Miniature CDs are cheap, and a bar for it will also be cheap. You can get them here: William Scully

They'll even court mount the mini for you if you wish.

Keep an eye out for the other CD, the GVIR issue, looks real nice with a square mount.

Don't hesitate to drop me a PM if you want hints on where to get the higher awards.

Cheers!

[Laurence Strong]

Hello Francois

When did the change makers?

[leigh kitchen]

Interesting - & I did'nt know that William Scully was still around, having always associated it with WWI & WWII Canadian badges Id've thought it would have gone belly up by now - or does that just happen in Britain?

The newer cast version - are these still the same design, with the young queen's head?

[JPL]

The "CD", or "12 years of undetected crime" medal as we jokingly call it.

Looks like an older model, good for you. The newer ones are from a different maker are soooo cheap! Molded instead of coined, and poorly finished. You can see file scrapings on the side, the ribbon hole is so small the ribbon barely fits through it and the bars don't even properly fit to the width of the ribbon!

TacHel

That's what happens when you have your medals produced by the "lowest bidder"... There is usually a reason why they are lower in price, and it normally shows in the finished product.

Sure glad I got my CD before the "el chipo" model appeared.

Jean-Paul

[Brian Wolfe]

Interesting - & I did'nt know that William Scully was still around, having always associated it with WWI & WWII Canadian badges Id've thought it would have gone belly up by now - or does that just happen in Britain?

The newer cast version - are these still the same design, with the young queen's head?

William Scully also produces insignis for police, fire and security services. This is probably the reason they have managed to stay in business for so long.

Regards

Brian

[TacHel]

Hello Francois

When did the change makers?

Over 10 years ago. Any CD you might have seen bestowed since that was of high quality manufacture was from older stock. The new ones are of extremely poor finish.

[TacHel]

Interesting - & I did'nt know that William Scully was still around, having always associated it with WWI & WWII Canadian badges Id've thought it would have gone belly up by now - or does that just happen in Britain?

The newer cast version - are these still the same design, with the young queen's head?

Yup, same design, cheaper manufacturing... Piss poor quality control!

[TacHel]

TacHel

That's what happens when you have your medals produced by the "lowest bidder"... There is usually a reason why they are lower in price, and it normally shows in the finished product.

Sure glad I got my CD before the "el chipo" model appeared.

Jean-Paul

Same here, I got mine in 1992. Even my mini for my mess kit is of exquisite detailing unlike the triple plated crap they sell today. The Queen looks like the Queen on my mini CD, on the new ones... She looks like Popeye the sailor! No detailing and too much plating!

It started with the Special Service Medal (SSM), molded, roughly improved by filing then triple plated... Garbage! Just about everything since has been of the same low quality. Oh how I miss the days when our medals were coined and of such crisp sharpness in the detailing... That time is unfortunately gone! Politicians would rather save a few measly bucks then to properly recognize the people who sacrifice so much in the service!

The ONLY exception in the past few years has been the Canadian Peacekeeping Medal, that one isn't too bad. At minimum, it's way better then the others!

[JPL]

TacHel

That's what happens when you have your medals produced by the "lowest bidder"... There is usually a reason why they are lower in price, and it normally shows in the finished product.

Sure glad I got my CD before the "el chipo" model appeared.

Jean-Paul

Same here, I got mine in 1992. Even my mini for my mess kit is of exquisite detailing unlike the triple plated crap they sell today. The Queen looks like the Queen on my mini CD, on the new ones... She looks like Popeye the sailor! No detailing and too much plating!

It started with the Special Service Medal (SSM), molded, roughly improved by filing then triple plated... Garbage! Just about everything since has been of the same low quality. Oh how I miss the days when our medals were coined and of such crisp sharpness in the detailing... That time is unfortunately gone! Politicians would rather save a few measly bucks then to properly recognize the people who sacrifice so much in the service!

The ONLY exception in the past few years has been the Canadian Peacekeeping Medal, that one isn't too bad. At minimum, it's way better then the others!

I refer to my SSM as my "chrome plated medal"...

JP

[TacHel]

I refer to my SSM as my "chrome plated medal"...

JP

Same here... I also received the 125th Ann. of Confederation medal... Yet another fine example of piss poor construction and finish.

[Hauptmann]

Hi Dan,

Nice court mounted CD with the case. The actual medal looks a lot nicer than the image you posted.

The CD is awarded for "12 years of service", but yours has an additional bar denoting 22 years of service (additional bars are awarded for each additional 10 years of service). Therefore, the ribbon bar will have one rosette in the centre of the ribbon.

Here is a link to the Canadian Forces medal website which has additional information on the CD:

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhr-ddhr/c...-eng.asp?ref=CD

A miniature should set you back about $15 Canadian. If you do a google search for: canada miniature medals for sale

you should get some sources.

Jean-Paul

Hi Jean-Paul,

Many thanks for your great comments. Now I really can't wait to see it when it gets here!

Dan

[Hauptmann]

The "CD", or "12 years of undetected crime" medal as we jokingly call it.

Looks like an older model, good for you. The newer ones are from a different maker are soooo cheap! Molded instead of coined, and poorly finished. You can see file scrapings on the side, the ribbon hole is so small the ribbon barely fits through it and the bars don't even properly fit to the width of the ribbon!

I used to court mount medals and the new CDs drove me NUTS!

Miniature CDs are cheap, and a bar for it will also be cheap. You can get them here: William Scully

They'll even court mount the mini for you if you wish.

Keep an eye out for the other CD, the GVIR issue, looks real nice with a square mount.

Don't hesitate to drop me a PM if you want hints on where to get the higher awards.

Cheers!

Mucho thanks for all this! I'll definitely check out the link you provided and may very well be in touch once I decide if I want to go ever deeper into yet another area of collecting.

Dan

[Tony Farrell]

I suppose it's whatever floats yer boat. I myself think that the CD is one of the most godawful designs ever to feature the sovereign's swede. The designer must have been hammered the morning he decided upon a glorified thrup'ny bit. In fairness, the GVI issue was slightly more appealing... but not much. Instead of re-designing the medal proper, they simply lopped off the suspender bar (similar to the Military LS&GC - see below illustration) and slaved on a bridge - which is why it's such a faff threading a mile-wide ribbon through an aperture little bigger than a keyhole. Gash drills in my book.

I am not a fan of Canadian awards generally, though some of those enameled orders look nice and well thought out - as you'd expect when rewarding someone for long or meritorious service. The Exemplary Service Medals are little better than the CD quality-wise, and I think I'd be somewhat miffed if I was presented with something that would look better suited hanging off a christmas tree.

The Australian long service awards fare little better, though the DLSM is a marked improvement over its predesessors on the quality control front. The Kiwis have no such bother - preferring (for now) to retain the more traditional design approach - and also retain several awards that are defunct in the country that instituted them... for the time being.

Anyhow Dan. Welcome to the world of long service awards - a much overlooked subject, and one that's incredibly complex... verging on science. Take the plunge. You know you want to.

There now follows a totally gratuitous shot of one of the CD's predecessors - a far nicer gong.

Edited June 24, 2009 by Tony Farrell

[Danny]

I am assuming you have received the medal by now. Have you considered obtaining this man's service record?

[Hauptmann]

I am assuming you have received the medal by now. Have you considered obtaining this man's service record?

Hi Danny,

Yes, I finally got it... took a while but it's here safe and sound. Would love to be able to do just that but I've no idea how to go about it or how much it costs, etc. Any advise, instructions, etc., would be deeply appreciated. Oh, out of curiosity do such records generally have a photo of the original recipient or is it just information?

Many thanks!

Dan :cheers:

[Guest Darrell]

Dan,

Unless things have changed:

Canada has an Access to Information Act (ATIPS) covering all information from approx. 1920 up. Exception - it does not cover WW2 service files for those who died (KIA or DOW) during the period 1939-46 who appear on Commonwealth War Graves Lists. These KIA files are fully open. All other 2nd war files and up are covered by ATIPS and files are available for those who served in WW2 to present day up to those released from the military more than 5 years ( exception are those still undergoing some form of medical release) One can apply under ATIPS for "relevant documents" from service files if there is no proof of death +20 submitted. At present there is a 3 month wait for the National Archives ATIPS to send back relevant copies. NA will supply RELEVANT COPIES which include Activity sheet showing all promotions, transfers, medal entitlement. What is removed or blacked out is all personal or 3rd person information. Personal information is reference to where/when born, pay, medical, discipline & photos.Should the file contain proof of death +20 years or supply proof of death +20 years this opens up the playing field. With proof of death +20 you can submit an ATIPS request or IF FOR IMMEDIATE FAMILY when service person is deceased less than 20 years. NA will give a Genealogy Package of significant documents and will leave in all personal information that the family applicant supplied and is the same as on the file.. They still remove other personal info but it is a much cleaner package for family AND THIS FILE IS SENT DIRECT BY NA TO THE FAMILY . There is a misconception that immediate family has some additional previledge but this is not the case. Only time this is a factor is when the deceased will means information is needed from the service file and a copy of the will must be submitted to support what information is required.

[Hauptmann]

Hi Darrell,

Many thanks for all that terrific info. So how does one go about getting this process started? And is there any cost? It sounds like either way it's a treasure trove of info and I'd love to put a history to this piece.

Dan :cheers:

[Danny]

Hi Dan

Message sent to you. Regards

Danny

[AJHaslett]

While the next to most recent batch of CDs were, I agree...horrendous, I have the great pleasure to report that the most recent examples are of considerably better manufacture. As I understand the Canadian Mint is now making these vice a private contract...(responsible for the abominations of the SSM and the 125) NEW SSMs are, apparently much nicer looking than the original "strikings/castings"

As an aside I would caution collectors with regards to the aforementioned seller as he has been involved in well-documented sales of altered medals.

Caveat emptor (maximus)

[TacHel]

Are CDs and SSMs now coined or is it only a better quality casting and plating job?

[AJHaslett]

Are CDs and SSMs now coined or is it only a better quality casting and plating job?

They are struck. I believe examples have been posted on there.

[TacHel]

They are struck. I believe examples have been posted on there.

On where?

[AJHaslett]

On where?

Sorry, on the BMF...British Medal Forum. I must have been distracted mid post!