Top of the navy in China 1900

[HeikoGrusdat]

Great group photo of the top of the german navy in China about 1900 - some very high officers with very big medal bars - can someone name these men???

[Guest Rick Research]

Not unless you make nice big EPSON scanner closeups.

Epsssssssssssssssssssssonnnnnnnnn

Epppppppppppppppppppsooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnn.

Until that happy day-- I think this is quite interesting to see the different ways that swords were "carried" at a trot-- from "walking stick" to "armpit umbrella" to "hip clutch." :cheers:

[GdC26]

Hard to be definite, but the person on the far left could be Prinz Heinrich, Wilhelm II's brother.

Is the person behind him, with the pith helmet, wearing adjutant's aguilettes?

Regards,

Sandro

[Guest Rick Research]

I don't think so. Then-Vizeadmiral zS Prince Heinrich left China in January 1900 just before anything happened.If that was him, he'd be festooned with stars.

From awards, I'd say the old bearded fellow in the middle-- who has some sort of breast star-- is the Top Dog of whatever moment this was.

Without being able to SEE the medal bars/ribbon bars clearly, no way to tell when this was taken.

[HeikoGrusdat]

.........I will post it next week again when my new scanner is running hot :jumping:

[Guest Rick Research]

:Cat-Scratch: You're getting an EPSON scanner?

(DO NOT GET A NOT-EPSON SCANNER. )

[GdC26]

Rick, I wouldn't rule out the possibility that that is Heinrich simply because no star is visible. Firstly, Herinrich tended to dress lavishly than his usually rahter overdressed brother, as the enclosed scans (and many more like it) bear out. And secondly, the raised left arm appears to hide what could be a star. The pic is too blurry to be definitive about either the decorations or the rank (Heiko, how many pips are there on the shoulderboard?) What puzzles me a bit is that the hilt on the saber of the person that could be Prinz Heinrich does not seem to be that of a naval saber.

Regards,

Sandro

[HeikoGrusdat]

....I really can`t see it 100% ... please wait for better scans next week, maybe you can see something more then...

Heiko

[HeikoGrusdat]

OK...................... next attempt................ better closeups of all persons and their bars.......... what you can`t see now you will see never because now you see the same on the screen as with the eyes

good luck - maybe someone will see a familiar face...

[HeikoGrusdat]

let`s give them numbers from left to right...

N°1

[HeikoGrusdat]

N°2

[HeikoGrusdat]

N°3

[HeikoGrusdat]

N°4

[HeikoGrusdat]

and N°5....

[Guest Rick Research]

Larger but still woefully BLURRY.

That does indeed appear to be crossed batons on the shoulder board of #1 but Prince Heinrich did not make that rank until 1909+.

I can't identify anyone from the blurs. IF there had been an exact place and date written on this, it would have been possible to count the number of smudges (one neck smudge or two? Five blurry medal bar things or seven... and so on) to identify officers from a known and dated ship's complement....

but not from this.

[HeikoGrusdat]

no problem Rick......... it was a try....... what remains is a great photo from great times - with or without names :beer:

[GdC26]

Rick,

You are right, Heinrich was appointed to the rank of Grandadmiral in 1909. However, according to Harald Eschenburg (Prinz heinrich von Preussen, p. 110 onwards), he did visit China again in 1912 (by rail!) on his way to Japan.

Heiko,

Is there anything in the pics that confirms the 1900 date mentioned in your first post, or could this be 1912?

Regards,

Sandro

[HeikoGrusdat]

I am very sorry but that 1900 was just said to show that we are talking about germans in china during or after the boxer rebellion 1900/1901 - of course it can be 1905 or 10..... nothing is written on the photo.

[GdC26]

I am very sorry but that 1900 was just said to show that we are talking about germans in china during or after the boxer rebellion 1900/1901 - of course it can be 1905 or 10..... nothing is written on the photo.

No problem, Heiko. Isn't the fellow in post 12 wearing an adjutantenabzeichen? And doesn't the beared, heavyset fellow have marshall's batons on his shoulders?

[HeikoGrusdat]

the problem is that the picture is in reality exact as blurry as on the scans..... I can`t see more than you

it can be that this is a Adjutantenabzeichen.... but I am not shure.

But I think we can date the picture after 1907 because the second man from left wears in the middle of his medal bar TWO campaign medals - china and DSWA / colonial medal , not shure about the second one , so after 1907 or after 1912 .....

small steps... ;)

[GdC26]

QED is the phrase, I believe.

The album is currently for sale on German e-bay (not mine, nor do I know the seller):

http://cgi.ebay.de/Fotoalbum-Kolonien-3-Seebataillon-Tsingtau-China-TOP-/290471388107?pt=Fotografien_Fotokunst&hash=item43a171a3cb

Regards,

Sandro

[HeikoGrusdat]

Wow....the same photo again... but mine seems to be much bigger :whistle:

[GdC26]

Wow....the same photo again... but mine seems to be much bigger

At least you have the names now.

Regards,

Sandro

[Kriegsmarine Admiral]

I strongly believe Number 4 (with the beard) is Char. Vizeadmiral Albert von Seckendorff, who was the Hofmarschall of Prinz Heinrich. Tell me what you think.

Some photos of him attached below.

Edited January 25, 2020 by Kriegsmarine Admiral

[Glenn J]

Most definitely. Note the Flügel-Adjutant badge of Kaiser Wilhelm I. Freiherr v. Seckendorff was the only naval recipient of this badge.

Regards

Glenn