rusticalex Posted April 23, 2010 Author Posted April 23, 2010 ...and finally, a close up of the crowd, in case that is of interest... Thanks Alex
Mervyn Mitton Posted April 23, 2010 Posted April 23, 2010 Alex - your blow-ups are very good - you must have a special programme. I think this is the first time I have seen the crowd in this set of photos. Stuart - The 'fat' figure in the middle is King Edward - The Duke of Connaught was the Queen's Uncle, but probably not senior enough for the first rank. Probably the two Emperors - Russia and Germany - both were sons-in-law to Queen Victoria. The hundreds of other 'minor' Royalty are probably the mob in the background. Interesting, it looks as if Generals and Admirals are flanking the catafalque. I mentioned the double line parade of Police - with the blow-up I can see (I think ?) ball tops to the men on the right. Does it mean they were drawn from Forces around the Country ? A single photo - and yet it represents just so much history.
Michael Johnson Posted April 23, 2010 Posted April 23, 2010 (edited) I don't know if there was a Canadian Militia contingent at the funeral, but in 1901 the white helmet would have been standard for them. Note the difference in patterns of water bottles. Edited April 23, 2010 by Michael Johnson
Stuart Bates Posted April 23, 2010 Posted April 23, 2010 Kaiser Wilhelm is on the white horse, Edward in the middle and unknown (Duke of Connaught?) making up the three. See blow-up below. As I said earlier the Duke of Connaught is specifically mentioned with the other two in the clip of the funeral that Simon found - "King Edward VII, Duke of Connaught and the Kaiser follow the coffin on horseback." So far I have not established that Tzar Nicholas II was even at the funeral which I find hard to believe. Must check harder.
Stuart Bates Posted April 23, 2010 Posted April 23, 2010 Alex, what did you use to get the splendid enlargements from the original photo? I took it into PhotoShop but it pixellated so quickly as to be useless. Stuart
Stuart Bates Posted April 24, 2010 Posted April 24, 2010 (edited) Michael, since Queen Victoria died on 22nd January 1901 and the funeral was held on 2nd February 1901 I doubt that there would have been enough time to organise Canadian Militia troops to attend the funeral. Unless, of course, they had previously sailed to England prior to embarking for South Africa. But that seems a very round-about way of getting into the Boer War. Stuart Edited April 24, 2010 by Stuart Bates
rusticalex Posted April 24, 2010 Author Posted April 24, 2010 Alex, what did you use to get the splendid enlargements from the original photo? I took it into PhotoShop but it pixellated so quickly as to be useless. Stuart Hi Stuart A simple process - I scanned the original with my Canon MP210, transferring it on to Picasa (a excellent free download off the internet which I use for all my photos), then cropped each section using Picasa, before using 'Paint' to reduce it down to under 150k. No great technology used - just a cheap printer/scanner and Picasa!! Alex
Mervyn Mitton Posted April 24, 2010 Posted April 24, 2010 Stuart - if it is the Duke of Connaught he must have had precedence as the Queen's Uncle. However, Royal protocal being what it is, I would have thought one of Her other sons - or, even Edwards son the Prince of Wales - would have been ahead ? Thinking about the Czar - I don't remember him being in attendance -- he would certainly have been with the King. I wonder what else we can turn-up just from this photo ? I have seen an order of service - probably one in the Museum of London - if anyone has a chance to call on them ?
rusticalex Posted January 19, 2011 Author Posted January 19, 2011 I turned up another photo of Queen Victoria's funeral the other day, to go along with the one that started this post, so I'll post it on here in case it is of further interest to anyone, along with some close ups. I wonder which hotel it is in the background?
coldstream Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Having just looked through this thread again the one thing that struck me was that all the military participents are wearing greatcoat order except for the immediate Pall Bearers escorting the carriage. Any thoughts on the reason? I have seen greatcoats worn by Pall Bearers so I can't believe it's a pracital reason but then I don't believe that it would have just been to show off the 'Home service uniforms? Best regards Simon
Stuart Bates Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) Simon, would not the fact that it was Winter be the reason for the greatcoats? It was the 2nd of February - was that a particularly cold/rainy day? The London Weather says of February "Most of the month was dry, rather cloudy and fairly cold" and I have read that snow began to fall after Queen Victoria was placed in the Frogmore Mausoleum. Stuart Edited January 19, 2011 by Stuart Bates
coldstream Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Stuart Exactly that, surely all those on parade should be in greatcoats but the Guards with the carriage just wear tunics. Hope all well by the way, been away for a while and just catching up! Simon
coldstream Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Post 23 shows the picture in question :cheers:
Stuart Bates Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) Simon, I had wondered where you had got to so welcome back. Post #23 is also interesting in that the first 4 sergeants would appear to be Grenadiers whereas the last seems to be a Coldstreamer, can't make out the plume though. Just had another look and maybe the last two are Coldstreamers? Stuart Edited January 19, 2011 by Stuart Bates
coldstream Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Stuart Hard to make out exactly but the last one nearest the camera is definately a Coldstreamer and if I'm not mistaken is a Lance Corporal!!
Stuart Bates Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Missed that one but is he not a Corporal rather than a Lance Corporal? Stuart
coldstream Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Stuart The strange Foot Guards rank system! Lance Corporals have two chevrons in white tape, Lance Sergeants (Corporals) Three chevrons in white tape, Sergeant, three chevrons in gold lace and a sash etc etc and so it goes on I'm afraid. Don't even ask about the Household Cavalry!!! Simon
Stuart Bates Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) Simon, I had that awful feeling that I should have checked before posting. But easier to make a mistake and have it corrected by an expert Then we all learn. Stuart Edited January 19, 2011 by Stuart Bates
coldstream Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Stuart Still seems an odd mixture of ranks and uniform for the Carriage party. I'd love to see the original orders for then funeral procession. Simon
Mervyn Mitton Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 GOOGLE - ' Queen Victoria's Funeral - order of procession'. Lots of good info. and pictures - incl. at no. 4 our thread ! I found separately the list of VIP's in the Procession - although not their exact places. However - these can be judged from the order of precedence. The Duke of Connaught was in the first row with King Edward and the Kaiser. He was the senior Royal Duke and the Uncle of the Queen. Sovereigns present : King Edward 7th.; Kaiser Wilhelm 2nd.; King George of the Hellenes (Greece); King Carlos of Portugal ; King Leopold of the Belgians. The Crown Princes of : Germany ; Rumania; Greece; Denmark; Norway; Sweden; Siam (Thailand). + The Arch Duke Franz Ferdinand (Austria Hungarian Empire); Grand Duke Michael Alexandrovitch (Russia); Duke of Aosta (Italy). This should help a little - unfortunately, they all look the same - arrogant and pompous and overdressed !
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