States Victory Medal

[Noor]

Hi all,

Here is my very first State Victory medal and what makes me very happy, I managed to obtain it with the 5 clasps!

Ribbon is a little pit broken next to the pin plate but mean time it just shows some wear and that it is period one!

Can someone please educate me more and have a look at those extras on the ribbon....

Can this combinations of clasps indicate some division entitlements?

Champagne - Marne (July 15-18, 1918)

Aisne - Marne (July 18 to August 06, 1918)

St. Mihiel (September 12-16, 1918)

Meuse - Argonne (September 26 to November 11, 1918)

Defensive Sector

Like I understand then Champagne - Marne clasp eliminate Navy option, am I right?

[Noor]

Closer look of the clasps...

[Brian Wolfe]

That's very impressive, Noor.

What a great medal for your first US WWI Victory Medal, I've still to get one.

Regards

Brian

[W McSwiggan]

My appreciation is that the only units with this precise combination and no others are the 26th Infantry Division and the 42nd Infantry Division. The 41st Division Field Artillery also was intitled to this exact combination.

In addition - a replacement who was assigned to the 3rd Infantry Division after the Aisne could also have worn this combination.

[Guest Darrell]

...........

Can this combinations of clasps indicate some division entitlements?

....

Absolutely, to a variety of divisions. Could be any of the following:

3rd, 26th. 41st (FA), or 42nd.

[Tim B]

Hi Noor,

You should post this one in the "Rest of the World: Medals & History" section, as we already have a very long running thread on WW1 Victory Medals there.

There are publications available that specifically call out which units were entitled to the various clasps, per engagement, and you can download or purchase these references easy enough. With that said, the example you show does cross over to a few units, specifically, the US 26th Division, 41st FA (field artillery), and 42nd Division. There could be other units, but these are the major ones that have this combination of clasps.

Tim

Here's my example of the same award:

[Tim B]

There you go, all about the same info on top of each other!

Tim

[Guest Rick Research]

I have retyped this from a list from the late 1960s. I do not know what, if any, relationship its original author had to our then-President-- but credit where credit is due, more than 40 years on.

[Tim B]

Hi Rick,

Yes, this Nixon matrix, along with the matrix Laslo lists in his first edition on Victory Medals ("The Interallied Victory Medals of World War I") give about the same information. Both matrix are a great, easy, quick reference to the major units that qualified for the campaign bars but, for the complete listing, you need the reference below which breaks it down by campaign and/or units.

You can Google the title and download it free through Google Books, or buy it or one of the reprinted versions for $20. or less. Not bad if you're into US Vics from WWI.

Tim :cheers:

[RobW]

Closer look of the clasps...

Hello Timo,

It looks like the DEFENSIVE SECTOR clasp has the remnant of spacers on the bottom. Could you have a closer look and see if it looks like there was spacers that have been subsequently removed. It should be clear from the side or reverse. Some examples of US vics have been seen with DEFENSIVE SECTOR clasps that have spacers.

Regards,

Rob

[johnnymac]

Hi Rick,

Yes, this Nixon matrix, along with the matrix Laslo lists in his first edition on Victory Medals ("The Interallied Victory Medals of World War I") give about the same information. Both matrix are a great, easy, quick reference to the major units that qualified for the campaign bars but, for the complete listing, you need the reference below which breaks it down by campaign and/or units.

You can Google the title and download it free through Google Books, or buy it or one of the reprinted versions for $20. or less. Not bad if you're into US Vics from WWI.

Tim

Hi, Here are several more possible candidates for your medal with these 5 clasps combo's. All are listed in Battle Participation of Organizations of the A.E.F in France, Belgium & Italy 1917 - 1918.

3rd Field Artillery Brigade, 3rd Ammunition Train (3rd Div).

66th Field Artillery Brigade, 146th & 148 FieldArtillery (41st Div.) were assigned the 2nd Corps. Whereas the 147th F.A. of the 41st Div. was assigned to another unit, that being the 42nd Div.

322nd Field Signal Battalion.

406th Telegraph Battalion.

1st Corps Observation Group, Air Service, 1st Army, 1stSquadron.

3rd Corps Observation Group, Air Service, 1st Army, 88thSquadron.

4th Corps Observation Group, Air Service, 2nd Army, 8thSquadron.

1st Pursuit Group, Air Service, 1st Army, 27th, 94th, 95th& 147th Squadrons.

1st Corps Balloon Group, Air Service, 1st Army, 2nd BalloonCompany.

3rd Corps Balloon Group, Air Service, 1st Army, 3rd BalloonCompany.

And I am sure the list goes on. These were Unit awards. Not all members assigned to these units were awards all the listedclasps.

JM

Edited October 27, 2010 by johnnymac

[Chris Liontas]

Now that is an outstanding medal. Congradulations!!!

Rick thanks a ton for posting that! It makes it so much easier than going through the unit histories!!! :cheers:

[johnnymac]

Now that is an outstanding medal. Congradulations!!!

Rick thanks a ton for posting that! It makes it so much easier than going through the unit histories!!!

The Nixon Matrix has several errors

35th, 80th and 91st is wrong, they are missing St Mihiel clasp.

He states that ONLY the 11th Eng. received the Cambrai clasp, he forgot the 12th Eng.

On the Russia clasp he wrote "ONLY the FRANCE or RUSSIA" clasp, but he forgot the DEFENSIVE SECTOR clasp if you were a combatant. A battle clasp was prized more than a service clasp. The same is true for SIBERIA with the Defensive Sector clasp.

On the 93rd Div.(color troops) it is true they served with the French and were armed with the Label rifles and wore the French accouterments and the French Adrian helmet but they kept their U.S. uniforms.(I have seen 2 photos of WWI colored Veterans from the 369th Inf. at their 10 year reunion, with a sign hung above the stage marked 369th 10th reunion, their Victory medal had 3 clasps.) I could not make out which clasps they were, but I'll bet they were, Champagne-Marne,Meuse-Argonne and the Defensive Sector clasps.

Here is a small list of other U.S troops under foreign commands who received their clasps:

1. The 27th & 30th Division after training they remained with the British command during the war. They were issued the No. III Lee Enfield rifle and British accouterments.

2. The 33rd Div 131st Inf., saw action under Australian General Monash.

3. Some of the 80th Div. saw action under Field Marshall Douglas Haig (Somme Offensive).

4. 332nd Inf. was under a Italian Command at Vittori Veneto.

5. The Navy's Grand Fleet was under Admiral Sir David Beatty.

Even the 12th & 14 Eng. attached temporarily to theB.E.F. at Cambrai. The 14th Eng. were under U.S.Army Col. Albert Jenkins who states, he was under the command of the British.

Nixon's matrix was written 50 years ago, it is good for astart.

JohnnyMac

Edited November 8, 2010 by johnnymac

[Ulsterman]

Wow!! I just learned something. I thought the above matrix was definitive.

[IrishGunner]

Here's my 5-clasp Victory Medal; a 1st Division soldier with Montdidier-Noyon, Aisne-Marne, St. Mihiel, Meuse-Argonne, Defensive Sector.

Alongside is a 3-clasp; Aisne-Marne, St. Mihiel, Defensive Sector. Not sure what unit - certainly not a full Division's award.

[Tim B]

Alongside is a 3-clasp; Aisne-Marne, St. Mihiel, Defensive Sector. Not sure what unit - certainly not a full Division's award.

Hi,

It could be attributed to a few different units, depending on when the member actually came in, and if he was wounded or killed prior to the Meuse-Argonne offensive. My first guess would be the US 4th Div and the guy was not in the fighting at Meuse-Argonne. Hard to say 100% without more information.

Tim