French gendarme with what look like REMF's, 1944(?)

[Mark C]

My guess that these are rear-echelon types rounded up in the summer of 1944. Certainly, it looks like police, firemen, and depot types all happy to be out of the war. (Although the gendarme seems to be the most satisfied with the situation.) Anyone ever see Germans in such shiny helmets elsewhere? Looks like two different types of helmet to me.

[Kev in Deva]

Helmet to the rear is a French Adrian helmet

the one to the front a brass firefighters helmet note the wearers two service ribbons, military service and the Ost Front medal.

Also many of them have their rank markings covered over on the shoulders boards which leads me to believe they are men from various units on some type of a course.

In my opinion they are on a break from the course and there is no

indication that the French Policeman is guarding them.

Kevin in Deva. :beer:

Edited January 9, 2011 by Kev in Deva

[Mark C]

Yes, strange that the only uniformity are the should strap slides. In all other respects they look like Beetle Bailey. Where's the policeman's belt?

And the soft cap in the very front - French not German?

[army historian]

Yes this is a very odd assortment - no usual for the Germans. It is possible that since none of the Germans has a weapon - and the French policeman is wearing a Sam Browne belt (he could be armed), they might be prisoners. The French Adrian, and French Fire fighter, helmets along with the Odd side cap (French or Russian?) just does not fit. One other point, what is with the shako? Is it French? Cheers Captain Albert

Edited January 11, 2011 by army historian

[Chris Boonzaier]

I would imagine about 1940 in newly occupied France and the guys are in their new quaters posing with some helmets and hats they have found.

I doubt they are POWs, it is an early war photo.

best

Chris

[Paul R]

My thoughts too Chris... plus some of the men are smiling. I dont think that they are prisoners at all. They look like victors to me.

[Chris Boonzaier]

I would imagine about 1940 in newly occupied France (no late war tunics, early war kinda medals) and the guys are in their new quarters posing with some helmets and hats they have found.

I doubt they are POWs, it is an early war photo.

The French police were not disbanded and he could have been there at any stage in the war.

best

Chris

[Kev in Deva]

Hi Paul R,

we get the message . . . . . really we do . . . .

Kevin in Deva. :beer:

[Mark C]

1940 new quarters? Then what about the Ost Front ribbon?

Might be late 1942 when occupying new quarters in newly occupied Vichy.

As for smiling prisoners - not unknown at all on the Western Front, so that argument can go either way. Can't tell about the gendarme either - maybe he gets his jollies putting the boche in the pen, or maybe he thinks Vichy collaboration is the cat's meow. And then again maybe he's just a happy kind of guy...

[army historian]

I just went over the photo again - Yes this is a very odd assortment - no usual for the Germans. It is possible that since none of the Germans has a weapon - and the French policeman is wearing a Sam Browne belt (he could be armed), they might be prisoners. The French Adrian, and French Fire fighter, helmets along with the Odd side cap (French or Russian?) just does not fit with serving soldiers. One other point, what is with the shako? Is it French? Also did anyone notice to the right of the gendarme there appears to be a person (cut off the photo) - that appears to be wearing a white US Helmet or Helmet liner like a US Military Policeman? I think the photo is 1944 or later and this assortment of Germans are prisoners - and happy to be out of the War. A couple don't look happy - and the German in the back of the photo doesn't have any head gear on. Also the two Germans in front are wearing East Front ribbons (not one). Cheers Captain Albert

Edited January 11, 2011 by army historian

[Kev in Deva]

The white "helmet" seems to have an odd shape to it, how about a French Colonial I tropical sunhat?, perhaps these troops have moved into a recently vacated French Barracks to do a course,

While at first glance the Shako is typical I believe for German Police units, when cropped and enlarged there appears to be a tri-color Rosette and under this a hole in the material where the insignia has been removed, the bill / peak of the shako is also more rectangular

in shape than the one on a Police shako.

I think they are all sporting items of French military headgear, as why would P.O.W.s be posing with French items?

Kevin in Deva, :beer:

[Gordon Williamson]

I agree with Chris. This is an early war photo, not 1944. All the uniforms are early, early field caps, most with the Waffenfarbe soutache which was ordered removed in 1942. Not an M43 field cap or M43 tunic in sight. The ribbon being worn isn't the East Front medal, its the "Flower Wars" Sudeten Medal.

[Kev in Deva]

Hi Gordon,

thanks for the correction with regards my erroneous id of the medal ribbon.

Kevin in Deva. :beer:

[Chris Boonzaier]

While at first glance the Shako is typical I believe for German Police units,

I think it is a french one. Dont the officer cadets at St Cyr wear these?

[Les-Art]

Hi Guys,

Just noticed this thread.

Thought you might be interested to know that the Gendarme , Marechal-des-Logis, is wearing the standard uniform prior to the Vichy Regime, which changed the insignias on the Kepi and collar.

He is wearing his issue belt, which could be worn with or without the pistol holster. Aigulettes would indicate an occassion of some kind as these were not worn on 'normal' duty.

This would all indicate that the photo is taken after the 'Fall of France'.

The Shako looks like the one issued to St Cyr cadets with a badge removed and the white helmet on the right appears to be the Colonial Helmet used by French forces overseas. So mnaybe they were 'liberated' from the local museum:)

Don't know if this helps in anyway.

Regards,

Les