Identifiable- To-Be-Medal Bars Number 9

[Claudio]

Another one for our dear Rick...

• Preußen, Eisernes Kreuz 1914, 2.Klasse (OEK 1909), E/S
• Preußen, Kriegsdenkmünze 1870/71 für Kämpfer mit den vier Gefechtsspangen Wörth, Sedan, Villiers und Paris (OEK 1941/4/10/13/24)
• Württemberg, Militär-Verdienstorden, RK 1914-1918 Kopie
• Württemberg, Wilhelmskreuz mit Schwertern (OEK 3078)
• Deutsches Reich 1933-45, Frontkämpfer Ehrenkreuz (OEK 3803/1), Hersteller GB
• Württemberg, Orden der Württembergischen Krone, Ritterkreuz, Gold (OEK 2938)
• Württemberg, Friedrichs-Orden, Ritterkreuz 1. Klasse, Gold (OEK 2980)
• Württemberg, Dienstehrenzeichen 1. Kl., Kreuz für 25 Dienstjahre, 1891-1921 (OEK 3089)
• Württemberg, Silberne Erinnerungsmedaille zum 25-jährigen Regierungsjubiläum König Karls, 1889 (OEK 3014)
• Preußen, Centenar-Medaille 1897 (OEK 1965), GBr

Stil un-identified!

Claudio

Edited August 7, 2013 by Claudio

[saschaw]

Great one... but are we looking for a WW1 winner of the WM3?

[Claudio]

I am not sure that it's WWI WM3, but you never know... was it also given during peace time?

[Guest Rick Research]

This bar makes me deeply unhappy. I cannot imagine any sane Württemberg--even one 90 years old--mounting in that precedence. Off to investigate IF possible.

[Guest Rick Research]

1914 EK/ M1913 WM3, WKzX, WK3, WF3a, 1870/71, no non-Wtbg awards, alive 1934. This does not compute. Nobody even close that I can turn up.

No way I can see that the bar could be right.

[saschaw]

was it also given during peace time?

No, but I didn't want to out-rule 1870/71... strange Rick doesn't come up with anyone. The hardware does look legit to me.

[Daniel Krause]

I would guess that the WM3 is an "upgraded" 1870(71 award.

From the 1st view I like it!

Lots of greetings

Daniel

[Claudio]

I also have some doubts that the EK2 1914 is the original one attached on this bar. Maybe a earlier EK2 1870 was replaced by a EK2 1914. All other orders and medals look tightly (very) attached to the ribbons and the bar. Also on the back it looks untouched, just WM3 has been attached with a different thread... But this doesn't disturb me, because very likely it was given back to the competent order chancery, when the wearer died.

...just some thoughts.... but by the way the bar is constructed, it's quite a typical Württemburg'sche Schnalle/Spange... look also how the ribbons on the back are folded (not like a bow)...

C

[Guest Rick Research]

All Württemberg Orders had to be returned--and from what Daniel has uncovered, ALL those returned were smelted as scarp bullion in the 1950s. A lot of 1 DM coins were made out of treasure.

I am more inclined to doubt this bar than Sambolini #1 for far more egregious errors and far fewer possibilities for gaps in our knowledge.

All the WM3 holders are known. No one matches for WW1--all the very few 1870 veterans had many other awards, including on their medal bars--and none were alive in 1935 who could under any combination of circumstances have worn this bar. Actually, an 1870 recipient might be more likely--ONLY that WilhelmskreuzX for WW1--simply have never focussed on the ancient ones.

In which case, that would indeed have been an 1870 EK2--with now missing "25" oakleaves as well. And why WOULD an 1870 WM3 recipient have turned in his startling crowned GOLD Cross for ... a wearing copy on the new ribbon? I can't get past a real recipient putting his WM3 after an 1870 medal. As you say, the back end of the bar looks appropriate for a retired Colonel, but the front half has been messed with. The pin is too short for the bar....

Monkey fingers have gotten at this. To what degree I can't yet tell.