Welsh Ranks on Police LSGC medals.

[bigjarofwasps]

With the impending introduction of the C111R version, coupled with the fact that Gwent, Dyfed Powys and SWP have not previously been giving their Officers the option to have their medals engraved in Welsh. Means that any E11R examples seen would be unique to NWP.

[bigjarofwasps]

Have confirmed that in North Wales Police where there is detective rank qualifying for the long service medal they do add DET for english & DTF for welsh preferences.

They have been ordering in this way for a number of years.

 

[bigjarofwasps]

 

Issued to a female officer from Dyfed Powys Police yesterday (06.06.24), having qualified 12 months ago. Interestingly she wasn’t given the option of whether she would like her rank engraved in Welsh or not. So it appears North Wales Police are the only force to be awarding Welsh engraved medals. Certainly any E11R versions seen, will be unique to NWP.

 

[bigjarofwasps]

I believe South Wales Police, have now embraced the concept of offering their officers the choice of whether they would like their medals engraved with their rank in Welsh. Would be interested to learn whether Gwent and Dyfed Powys have yet begun to do so? As it stands now any E11R versions, with the rank in Welsh, are unique to North Wales Police. But am yet to see any examples come onto the market.

[bigjarofwasps]

Some more information which has come to light when referring to the use of Welsh ranks. In particular the rank Cwnstabl (Constable) when used in connection with Ditectif (Detective) it becomes Gwnstabl. 

 

The word changes depending on where it appears in a sentence and what context it is being used in, therefore Gwnstabl replaces Cwnstabl when used in conjunction with Ditetcif (Detective. Conversely  it should in point of fact be Gwnstabl Ditectif but that is taking it a little to far grammatically, when engraving medals perhaps.

 

Where as the same is not true when using  Prif Arolygydd or Chief Inspector, the Prif or Chief/Main remains the same way around and not Arolygydd Prif as you would think. 

 

All very confusing, but I thought it might be of assistance to someone in the future when one of these medals comes onto the market. 

[Megan]

As a Welsh speaker, this is correct.

 

The bit about Cwnstabl turning into Gwnstabl is technically called 'mutation', it's supposed to make a sentence flow more smoothly. There are rules about mutations but I don't actually know them, it's just natural to me!

 

Like many borrowed words in Welsh, although Cwnstabl looks odd to an English speaker, it is pronouced the same as "Constable".

 

Throughout the pandemic, one of the high spots was that the Welsh for coronavirus was.... coronafeirws! Which, of course, is just a translation of coronavirus into Welsh phonetics. That's what we do with borrowed words, and is why they sound the same although they look very different!

 

'Prif' always comes before the word that is being referred to as the 'Chief' or 'Highest' - for example, a university is a prifysgol (ysgol means school).

[bigjarofwasps]

Ditectif (Detective) Gwnstabl (Constable)

 

[bigjarofwasps]

Have been in correspondence with the recipient of this medal. She qualified in 2009 (22 years service required prior to 2020), she’d also been a DC for several years when she qualified. As can be seen her medal is engraved Cwnst, which suggests that DTF Gwnst wasn’t used at that time? If so then this reduces the issue window for DTF Gwnst on the E11R effigy version down to only 14 years? 
 

[Megan]

How much say does the recipient have over what appears on their medal, apart from being able to say they want it in Welsh?

 

(eek, my mind swirched over to Welsh, took ages to formulate the question in English! 🤓)

[bigjarofwasps]

Interesting development, the example on the top is to a male sergeant and engraved Rhing, the example underneath is to a female sergeant and engraved Rhgll.

[bigjarofwasps]

49 minutes ago, bigjarofwasps said:

Interesting development, the example on the top is to a male sergeant and engraved Rhing, the example underneath is to a female sergeant and engraved Rhgll.

 

I’m advised that the example on the bottom, is more grammatically correct.

Rhngll is Sgt
Rhing is Serg

 

But certainly further scope for collecting, trying to find examples of both! 

[Megan]

The Welsh for "sergeant" is "rhingyll"... if you say "rhing" it's a bit like saying "sarge" - OK in conversation, not so much in official documents or indeed medals.

[bigjarofwasps]

On 18/10/2024 at 09:12, Megan said:

The Welsh for "sergeant" is "rhingyll"... if you say "rhing" it's a bit like saying "sarge" - OK in conversation, not so much in official documents or indeed medals.

Here’s another example to add to the catalog.
 

Note the PR and not PRIF. 

Hoping to be able to confirm which force and when it was qualified for soon. 

Edited November 7 by bigjarofwasps

[bigjarofwasps]

17 minutes ago, bigjarofwasps said:

Here’s another example to add to the catalog.
 

Note the PR and not PRIF. 

Hoping to be able to confirm which force and when it was qualified for soon. 

Confirmed as North Wales Police.

[bigjarofwasps]

On 07/11/2024 at 22:53, bigjarofwasps said:

Here’s another example to add to the catalog.
 

Note the PR and not PRIF. 

Hoping to be able to confirm which force and when it was qualified for soon. 

A grammatically correct example.

Interestingly the below example, was awarded before the above example.