Soviet My first documented group

[Bryan]

I'm posting my first documented group in my collection that just came in today. I like to collect items or medals related to the city of Berlin. So I decided to buy this medal group which comes from a soldier who did the Battle of Berlin. Anyway, I'm not sure if everybody who was awarded the "Medal for the Capture of Berlin" did fight on the street of Berlin???

Here is what consist my first little group. Maybe not that impressive, but for me it is a good start for my collection in collecting medals group.

9 medals (including one Polish medal and one civilian medal)

1 order

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Awarded to Vladimir Tschibulsky Kuzmy

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Red Star #1.622.694 in booklet

Mounted together:

Combat Service Medal #2.179.894, mentioned in order booklet

Combat Service Medal unnumbered, mentioned in order booklet

Victory over Germany, w/doc

Capture of Berlin, w/doc

Following mounted together:

Liberation of Warsaw, w/doc

30th Anniversary of Armed Forces, no doc

Polish Oder, Neisse, Baltic medal, with 2 documents for this medal

20th anniversary of Victory w/doc

The group also contains a civilian medal on blue ribbon for winning the 1st place in a 500 meter event for running, swimming or something else?

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Following documents present, but NO medals:

30,40 Anniversary of Victory

50,60,70 Anniversary of Armed Forces

25th Anniversary of Victory veteran badge

There is also missing to this group a # 3 548 078 Red Star, probably awarded for long service which is listed in order booklet.

And the 40th Anniversary of Armed Forces medal and document are missing.

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Is there anything else I should know about this group that I forgot to mention?

[Bryan]

[Bryan]

[Bryan]

[Bryan]

[Gerd Becker]

Very very nice group, Bryan The ribbons for the Warsaw Medal and the and the 30 years Army and Fleet are switched. But i would probably leave it like it is though.

Congrats to your first group

[Guest Darrell]

Very nice Bryan

Also unique is the first grouping. All the ribbons are in a "Reversed" State, yet still mounted in the correct "Ordering", thus the ribbons overlap the wrong way as well. You see the odd one with the ribbon mounted like this but rarely the entire medal grouping on 1 bar

[Bryan]

The ribbons for the Warsaw Medal and the and the 30 years Army and Fleet are switched.

Thank you guys. Yes I have noticed that, but I will never touch that. I also have a Sebastopol medal in my collection with the Odessa ribbon, which I think is better to leave it like this because there is some wear on it.

All the ribbons are in a "Reversed" State

Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I didn't notice it. The first mounted group you are right, but not the second.

What is also interested is that the 20th anniversary of Victory medal is not really monted with the other medals, but it has been stitched to the 3 other medals.

[Guest Rick Research]

Oooooo, RESEARCH time!!!

Guards Major Vladimir Kuz'mich Tsybul'sky/Tsybul'skii/Tsebul'sky/Tsibul'sky (they can't seem to have figured out a consistent spelling!) is shown stamped in his Orders Book and on the Victory Over Germany and Capture of Berlin as

on staff of Department of Cadres, 1st Guards Tank Army

and you know what THAT means (see Dubrovin researched group thread)

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=3222

His Soviet medal for Warsaw shows him on the Staff of Commander of Bases of the 1st Guards Tank Army

so you have yourself a General Headquarters lounge lizard comrade there!

Red Star 3,548,078 is indeed for 15 years long service-- that is one of the mass awards made on 30 December 1956.

It looks like he had left before eligibility for the 1958 Armed Forces jubilee, but certainly must have made Lieutenant Colonel by 1956.

Another interesting thing is that his campaign medal documents call him "COMRADE" and do not give his military rank. Very interesting and perhaps significant if he was the Official Party Sneak or some such.

DEFINITELY worth researching his WW2 Red Star and

Military Merit Medal

and getting his complete service record along with those citations and Award Record Card...

but DON'T ask for him by his "names"-- go with the serial numbers and Orders Book serial number and let the archives figure out what his name REALLY was!

What do his POLISH Oder, Neisse, Baltics say about him?

[Gerd Becker]

Nice photo in the document, btw.

Edited April 5, 2006 by Gerd Becker

[Riley1965]

Bryan, WOW!!! That is one superb group!!! Here's to research .

I can't wait to see the rest of the story.

Regards,

Doc

[Guest Rick Research]

And from our good friend Steen Ammentorp's website, complete with circa 1970 photo of said Generalmajor Commanding Bases of 1st Guards Tank Army (hey Steen, now you can place his job into early 1946, too! ) Kon'kov:

[attachmentid=33420]

[Bryan]

Thank you very much guys and thanks to Rick for helpful informations. This is only my first documented group, but I guess I'm getting addicted to documentation. I always thought it was too expensive to buy them with the docs, but now I want more.

I won't be able to research them before next autumn, because I'm leaving next week for Europe to finish my studies. So I'll need that extra money during my studies.

By the way, here are the other paper work. I didn't post them before, because I thought there was enough information with the other documentation. Note the different stamps and writings on the 2 Polish documents.

Edited April 5, 2006 by Soviet

[Bryan]

[Bryan]

[Riley1965]

Bryan,

You've struck gold my friend. You know more about your group than I know about my Husband & Wife group. Congrats on a great find!!!

Doc

[Gerd Becker]

Thank you very much guys and thanks to Rick for helpful informations. This is only my first documented group, but I guess I'm getting addicted to documentation. I always thought it was too expensive to buy them with the docs, but know I want more.

Eh, Eh, Eh

[Guest Rick Research]

AaaaaaHA! 1948 armed forces jubilee medal says he was a Guards Engineer-Major BUT

THAT has the stamp of the Military Council of the 1st Guards Tank Army (old stamp with pre-1947 unit name and pre-1946 Soviet state seal), correctly written in as

1st Guards Mechanized Army-- one of the main "World War Three" units stationed in East Germany.

His Polish documentshave only Field Post unit number, agh.

1965 and 1975 show him living in Lazarevsky Raion Veterans Commissariat area of the city of Sochi.

And his 1970 MoD jubilee badge shows that he did indeed retire as a Lieutenant Colonel--

but "Comrade" Howeverhisnamewasspelled must indeed have been a COMMISSAR.

Better put in for that research now, so it will be READY by next winter!

[Bryan]

Wow so much information for a so small group!

I didn't know at first that it would worth researching such small group with common orders, but now I am really tempted to research it. I didn't know there was so much information lying in those common paper work!

This guy must have been lucky to live on the Black See cost in Sochy. It must have been some kind of a reward in return from his services.

I know little about commissars, but what make you think he could have been one.

And a last question. Considering that the 20th anniversary of the Victory medal is attached to the second medal bar, would it be possible he didn't have the 40th Anniversary of Armed Forces medal, because it would have been placed before the 20th anniversary of the Victory medal.

I have no idea.

[Guest Rick Research]

Because he was "Comrade" instead of his rank for the WW2s, and because he was on ARMY level staff, and the "Military Council" which was the "Board of Commissars."

The 1970 badge with his last rank as Lieutenant Colonel means he only went up one rank from what he was in 1946-- so that means all but certainly that he retired between 1957-58.

[Bryan]

Thanks again Rick! It is always interesting to learn from you.

[Steen Ammentorp]

And from our good friend Steen Ammentorp's website, complete with circa 1970 photo of said Generalmajor Commanding Bases of 1st Guards Tank Army (hey Steen, now you can place his job into early 1946, too! ) Kon'kov:

Great another piece to the puzzle.

Kind Regards

Steen Ammentorp

The Generals of World War II

[Bryan]

Hello, I'm ready to research my first group. Ricky said :

DEFINITELY worth researching his WW2 Red Star and Military Merit Medal. and getting his complete service record along with those citations and Award Record Card...

So that means I should ask for 2 awards citations and the service record.

I guess it doesn't really worth asking for the award card of the soldier, because I have already the order book. Does it worth to ask for the personal file of the soldier? What can we normally learn? Thanks for your help!

[NavyFCO]

I guess it doesn't really worth asking for the award card of the soldier, because I have already the order book. Does it worth to ask for the personal file of the soldier? What can we normally learn? Thanks for your help!

If you're going to ask for research through the normal researcher, you will have to get the award card. In order to avoid buying the award card, you need the date and place of birth of the recipient, which are not in the order book. Also, the award card will verify if the group is complete or not.

As far as the personnel file, why not? If you're planning on keeping the group, and don't mind the extra investment, this can tell you a lot about who the person was. It has their biographies, their service reports, etc. Lots of good stuff!

Dave

[Ed_Haynes]

Dave is right. It is always better, and not significantly more expensive, to go for full research.