Claudius

photo...

reverse

obverse cross

back, with hanger

With all the great work Noor did on this St. George Cross, I thought I would post mine as well. From the dark color of the metal, it almost appears like tarnishing silver to me. You can see on the reverse the deeply etched serial numbers as well as the "3" class number.

You can id them! Can you id my 4th Class? "223 342" Thank you in advance.

Noor; It looks GREAT! I like it a lot. Important note to everyone, (if you will forgive me for saying/pointing this out)....you mentioned using cardboard from the art shop. Be sure to use only paper and paper products from art stores because they are usually acid-free. Anything that comes in contact with the medals, ribbons, photos needs to be acid-free. My riker mounts usually don't have this cardboard matting. But I can see that when you do it, it makes it museum-display quality. It really brings it up a notch.

Nice scale. I should get one for the shows. Although I suspect (some) dealers wouldn't like it when you weight their inventory and be confronted with the scientific evidence.

Yes, Grabow. (I should have added that.) But in 1936 I think is was in Penig because that is where the militär-Dienstzeitbescheinigung was filled out.

Luektke K. L.d.R./Hauptmann 1898 January 22nd born 1914 September 16th 2 Recruit Depot Ersatz Battalion, Gren. Regiment 11 (as a war-volunteer) 1915 January 15th Reserve Infantry Regiment 34 March 18th – April 4th for training, course of instruction for Aspirant Officer Cadet August 14th Landwehr Infantry Regiment 34 September 13th – 23rd Battle at Wilna (Vilnius, Lithuania) November 4th – August 8th 1916 Trench warfare before Riga 1916 March 25th 1914 EK2 w/ IR 34 November 4th – August 8th 1916 Trench warfare before Riga August 11th Armee-FlugPark 8, Examination on suitability as an Observer. September 22nd Transfer to FEA 3 as Pilot September 26th Transfer to Gotha flight school 1917 February 25th Distance flight training with FEA 3 April 16th – 25th [general info.: 2nd Battle of Aisne, aka: Chemin des Dames] May 30th joined Kampfgeschwader OHL #2, in the Field Staffel 11 May 30th – July 19th Trench warfare at the Chemin des Dames [Aisne] June 20th z.Staffel 11 transfer July 1st Promotion to Lieutenant d.R. May 30th – July 19th Trench warfare at the Chemin des Dames August 31st Pilot badge awarded October 20th – December 19th Trench warfare at the Chemin des Dames, same as before December [gen. info.: Kampfgeschwader OHL, change to Bombengeschwader OHL] 1918 January 29th “general info.: quote “In connexion with the subject of remunerative targets for bombing squadrons, the following order, dated 29 January, 1918, has points of interest:- “Seeing that in spite of repeated protests and threats of reprisals, the enemy has recently carried out bombing raids on open towns in Germany (Mannheim, Lahr, Freiburg, etc.), the Supreme Command has ordered the Squadron [i.e. Bombengeschwader 2] to attack the fortress of Paris. Objectives are to be confined to targets such as railway stations, public buildings utilized for military purposes (Ministry of War, G.H.Q., Ministry of Marine, Supply Depots, Barracks, etc.). The following are not to form bombing targets:-Hospitals, churches, and buildings having artistic value.” unquote –Handbook of German Military and Naval Aviation,Oct 1918 pg 67.” January 30th / 31st Squadron attack on Paris [night attack] January 31st Captured by the French [shot down?] September 5th Wound badge -Black awarded [as a POW?, wounded when shot down?] 1921 September 28th 1914 EK1 w/ 2nd Kavalry Division 1940 July 5th 1939 EK1 Clasp as a Captain in Fluftflotte 2, Unit 4(F)./122 September 16th LuftFlotte 2: Unit 4(F)./122 in a Ju88, designation “F6+HM”. Battle of Britain -MIA in recon flight near Lincolnshire, England. Shot down by Spitfires from 616 Squadron over a convoy at 9:40 GMT. Ju88, designation: F6+HM Crew: Olbt. Hans Starkloff Hptm Kurt Luedtke Uffz. Pawletta Oberarzt Dr Ulrich Guizetti [crew complement was in violation of an order issued two days earlier that stated that flights were NOT to have too many ranking officers aboard.] October 14th Reported missing to Frau Luedtke.

Speedytop: Thank you for the translations Uwe. I have made the notations and corrections to my work. Jaba1914: You are right about KAGOHL becoming BAGOHL. My reference indicates that the change occured in December 1917. Thank you for the information on the units. I have a chronology prepared and as I mentioned, I will post it. My next immediate area of reseach is the Bombing attack on Paris, Jan 30/31, 1918. I would like read an account of the action, Allied victory claims?, Are there any good books that describe the action?

Greeting All; I have a great document group to a flieger that I would like to share with you. I am piecing together his career from his documents and his Militär-Dienstzeitbescheinigung but I’m coming across some words and abbreviations that I can’t read. Even my "German Military Terms 1918" -Battery Press, book is not helping. While this may spoil some of the story, a brief background may be necessary for those who can tell me what these unknown words mean. Luedtke L.d.R. began his war career on the ground on the Russian front, earned the EK2 in the trenches near Riga. Transferred to flight training and was assigned to Kampfgeschwader 2, Staffel 11. Captivity on Jan 31, 1918. Here is the actual entry for the EK2 Eisernes Kreuz zweiter Klasse (ohne Verl.Dat.) Question: What does “without Verl.Dat.” mean? Here is the entry for the assignment to KG2,S11 on May 30, 1917. "z.Kampfgeschwader O.H.L.Nr.2 in the Field Staffel 11" Straight forward meaning, however for the June 20, 1917 entry it mentions; “Staffel 11, versetzt.” Question: What does “versetzt” mean? Here is the May 30-July 19, 1917 entry “Stellungskämpfe am Chemin des Dames” straight forward meaning, however the entry for October 20-Decmeber 19 is “desgl.” Question: What does “desgl.” Mean? On Jan 31, 1918, the entry is “von einem Frontflug nicht zurückgekehrt, in franz. Gefangenschaft geraten.” Two questions: I understand that he did not return from a front line flight, but what is “in franz.” mean? If this is an abbreviation for “französisch”, shouldn’t the “F” be capitalized as in “Franz.”? Or does “franz.” mean something else? Other question: What does “geraten” mean in context of in captivity? Does it mean “assumed or guessed”? Finally, on the front page, under the year heading of “1918” it simply says “umstehend” my translation is “as stated overleaf”. Is this right? Does this mean refer to back page? Once I have a clearer picture of this gent along with some research, I will post his chronology. Thank you for any help you can give me.

wonderful. I never saw the document before. Thank you for showing it. :cheers:

Do you mean the kriegsdenkmünze 1870-1871 for combatant? and the doc? $40+ish on the medal. $100+ish on the document. but I'm afraid to say they are both on the common side. However, if both are in great shape, with orginal ribbon...could work out. If there are battle bars at at least $25 each. Much more for the rare ones. Anybody else have an idea on prices?

As a POW did he write any letters? Did the family send any letters to him as a POW? Where he was a POW could be a clue as well.

True, but it seems to be a a choice of the wearer. I have one bar with it mounted correctly, and another F-P war frack bar that has it reversed. :lol:

Just pointing it out. Not all BMVs have it. I recall once that someone wanted to use that as a "tell" denoting a fake construction. Since then others have refuted this and said it was a genuine feature on a genuine piece. The BMV on this bar would also add to the growing evidence.

I always like seeing the BMV and BMVK on a medal bar together. A preserved progression of merits he earned. Wow, is this one in rough shape...but then again, this kind of "aging" is very hard to fake. Anyone else notice the thicker metal border on the BMV's 6 o'clock arm reverse?

Now, now...my mother is a woman in menopause. Even in jest, we don't want to insult her because she is a woman. We want to insult her because she is an verbally-abusive, narrow-minded, greedy, terrorist. Even if she is not going to behave in a gentlemanly manner doesn't mean that we shouldn't. After all this is the "Gentleman's" Military Interest Club open to both genders and we do have at least one other woman here.

;)

Pierce; No apologizes necessary! I'm delighted to see your Schwarzburg bar. Thank you for adding it here to this thread.

Claudio; It would seem I was premature in lauding your document group. A remarkable set of documents to a flieger. His ordensspange...if it does ever show up it should be easily identifiable.

I think you scared him off. All the offerings have been removed.

Or it is a frankenstein construction. The medal on the end is surely the Honor Medal for "Verdienst im Krieg", a combatant award. It wouldn't ordinarily belong on the end like this. To compare, does anyone have an example of a double Schwarzburg award on a medal bar or ribbon bar?

Interesting...anyone else notice that the caption is written in english. Did he have an english-speaking fan that collected his photograph?