HeikoGrusdat

here are two different lion reverses....

Gentlemen and especially Vince.... we had this some times before but again in short words: ELEPHANT Order (Kolonialabzeichen) was a OFFICIAL award of the reich during the Weimar times up to ca. 1938. It could be given to all men who served in the former german colonies all over the world. You had to ask for it and you had to pay for it.... if you had colonial service in your military pass you could get one of these. It was awarded in a total number of ca. 8500 pieces and there are several variations existing of different materials. LION Order (Kolonialauszeichnung) was a INOFFICIAL award from the veterans organizations. If you were member of a colonial veterans organization (Kriegerverein) and you had colonial service in your papers you could get one of these... there are no numbers of awards because of the inofficial thing.... 1.class breast cross given for combattant service in the colonies, 2.class ribbon award was given for merit for the colonies in germany or home service in general. It was possible to wear both classes (real warriors... ) but then you did not get the second award document for the non-comattant one.... I am a little short in time now but maybe I can find some pictures later for this thread... Heiko

another inofficial thing.... and these 4 are really the only ones I have seen in my lifetime which do not belong to ww1 battles - but all of these EK-clasps were private purchases, so the maker would have been done what the proud soldier has ordered.....

I think he wants to create a new german "Wirtschaftswunder"... maybe he wants to get the manager of the year or something like that...

Now we come to the clue.... look what papa has found..... the following clasps are 100% the same : same makers mark, same style, same material - BUT : THE PLACES ARE FREIKORPS BATTLES !!!!! I have never seen this before, maybe private purchased like the other clasps but for an EK given for Freikorps fights??? I think we will never know exactly but it gives more space for further thoughts... ENJOY!!!

I know many EK docs dated after 1918 - but they are ALL for awards given between 14-18 !!! But why not... maybe some Freikorps leaders had some EK`s in their bag left and awarded them to their men (a bit inofficial of course...) I would like to give this statement more weight with the following pictures.... I think most of the imperial german collectors know the silver made battle clasps that were especially made for the EK2 - they are not very often to find but I am lucky enough to have some... the following picture shows what they look like, here are some examples:

I think it is a very simple solution... something like a prussian man that has moved to saxony or another state later, I would say this could be for example a "Treue in der Arbeit" medal, or a Nassau Landwirtschaftsmedal, or a floodmedal Saxe-Altenburg 1890........ some kind of "civil merit"

Rick I know what you are talking about.... IMPOSSIBLE!!!!!

Paul, that`s not easy because it is a one-coloured green ribbon which offers many possibilities... we are in a time frame from 1866, 1870/71 and before 1897... there are several medals from saxon, saxon duchies, too many possibilities to guess the right one - BUT - good for you, you can choose one of the many to complete your bar... but you will never 100% know if it is the right one...

Thanks for all this great information Rick... his story sounds a bit like the one of Hauptmann aD Sievert that Paul and I were working on last days... AR1X in 1915 and then back home to mum - sudden end of careers...

and the detail...

reverse

Woouuuwwww.... as always Mr.Research himself fascinates me!!! Thank you very much for the information... I had this bar for many years, once purchased from Tony Colson, and never thought about an ID with this combination... I wanted to get more info on the rank and the order and now I have a name - Thank you!!! As a little gift for the community here is another greek redemeer on another medal bar, better enamel work, and to make it very interesting ..... together with a turkish Medjidie ENJOY!!!

Hi Joe, especially for you here is the crown...

it is the greek order of the redemeer (in german "Erl?serorden") - but that?s all I know...

great enamel artwork!!!

and the reverse...

Hello gentlemen, here is my weekly medal bar question... today I want to show you a nice medal bar, unfortunately a bit damaged but still very nice to me!!! I want to learn a bit more about the greek order today, which time period, to whom awarded and so on.... every information is helpfull maybe there is a guess about the rank of the owner possible - I know you are in good mood this weekend thanks for your help Heiko

the combination of green-white and black-white looks really great in the display - very nice group!!!

don`t listen to the twin`s crazy carnival songs or you will be a part of their flying circus very soon... Keep the group as it is together!!!

wonderfull authentic piece - I love these...

the small box is much more rare than the bigger one... price is ok

may I ask what roads I have to drive to find these bars...??? Great stuff!!! Rick, when is your birthday? I think I have to send you a 1897 ranklist...

there was no FAM in gold, only bronze and silver, but some people wanted to make the medal bar a bit more shiny and gilded the bronze ones.... looks good

yea, the crosses are the same but there were 4 different ribbons for each.... normal combattant and non-combattant ribbons are sometimes to find, but the other two.... nearly no way