Bob

I heard a rumor (for what it is worth) that during the NATO bombing Milosjevic moved into the former Tito residence (assuming it would not be bombed) and that his son (Marko) found the orders (and weapons) of Tito in the cellar and took them. Anybody who is friends with the Milosjevic family who can verify?

Updated A MEDALS 1 1914 Accession Medal 2 Commemorative Medal of 24 December 1924 a Gold (not sure) b Silver c Bronze B ORDER OF BLACK EAGLE (1914) 1 Grand Cross (consisting of cross + breast star) 2 Grand Officer (consisting of neck badge + breast star) 3 Commander 4 Officer 5 Knight 6 Medal a Gold b Silver c Bronze B6 sighted both as Willibald Kluge and Arthus Bertrand produced. C ORDER OF SCANDERBEG (1925) 1 Grand Cross (consisting of cross + breast star) 2 Grand Officer (consisting of neck badge + breast star) 3 Commander 4 Officer 5 Knight C1-5 are found in two types: - type 1 (1925-1940) i.e. left facing goat (?) - type 2 (1940-1944) i.e. right facing goat D HONOR COLLOR OF ALBANIA (1925) E ALBANIAN KNIGHTS OF MALTA ORDER (1926) 1 Collar 2 Grand Cross Badge 3 Commander 4 Officer (breast badge) 5 Knight F ORDER OF FIDELITY (1926) 1 Grand Cross (consisting of cross + breast star) 2 Grand Officer (consisting of neck badge + breast star) 3 Commander 4 Officer 5 Knight F1-5 are found in two types: - type 1 (1926-1940) - type 2 (1940-1944) i.e. FERT G ORDER OF BRAVERY (1928) 1 1st class neckbadge 2 1st class breast star 3 2nd class neckbadge 4 3rd class medal

Thanks Eric, when it becomes too detailed, I will let you know:) Just trying to (long overdue) get a decent typology in one place. How do you see the difference between Kluge and Bertrand if I may ask?

http://www.emedals.ca/catalog.asp?item=A967#bigPic http://www.ormedec.com/ http://www.omsa.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3825 links to the catalogue i was referring to... have placed an order and hope to get it soon, a very handy couple of pages on pre-socialist Albanian awards

Hi Eric, thanks - will add badges to structure as well. Will also send you a PM on different topic.

OK, the reason i started this thread is because i want to dip further into pre-socialist albanian awards. The era's we are discussing then are: - 1914 = Wied - 1920-1928 = Republic - 1928-1939 = King Zog I - 1939-1943 = Italian occupation - 1944-onwards = People's Republic In order to start dipping deeper, I was really looking for a good typology... but couldn't make much sense out of the threads in place. So started (on paper) to create one overview... with more questions than i would have imagined. Then i spent today with a dealer/collector in Belgrade. Sharing anecdotes, him showing me his Albanian, Yugoslav, etc. collection, sipping some Rakija in between, and presto this gentleman starts digging into his ODM book collection... and after a while a local catalogue comes out with what appears to be an exhaustive typology (as well as many pics, price indications, etc.). So, I'll try to get a copy of this catalogue in coming weeks (e.g. it contained an Albanian Collor which is different than the one shown in threads here as well as other new items). I already am copying the typology here though. For the moment, leaving badges out... leaving that for later. A MEDALS 1 1914 Accession Medal 2 1924 Commemorative Medal B ORDER OF BLACK EAGLE (1914) 1 Grand Cross (consisting of cross + breast star) 2 Grand Officer (consisting of neck badge + breast star) 3 Commander 4 Officer 5 Knight 6 Medal: gold / silver / bronze C ORDER OF SCANDERBEG (1925) 1 Grand Cross (consisting of cross + breast star) 2 Grand Officer (consisting of neck badge + breast star) 3 Commander 4 Officer 5 Knight C1-5 are found in two types: - type 1 (1925-1940) i.e. left facing goat (?) - type 2 (1940-1944) i.e. right facing goat D HONOR COLLOR OF ALBANIA (1925) E ALBANIAN KNIGHTS OF MALTA ORDER (1926) 1 Collar 2 Grand Cross Badge 3 Commander 4 Officer (breast badge) 5 Knight F ORDER OF FIDELITY (1926) 1 Grand Cross (consisting of cross + breast star) 2 Grand Officer (consisting of neck badge + breast star) 3 Commander 4 Officer 5 Knight F1-5 are found in two types: - type 1 (1926-1940) - type 2 (1940-1944) i.e. FERT G ORDER OF BRAVERY (1928) 1 1st class neckbadge 2 1st class breast star 3 2nd class neckbadge 4 3rd class medal ================================= I will try to obtain the catalogue with color pictures and post scans here to illustrate the above. From that moment, i think this should provide an interesting base for discussion. Appreciate any comments - please do not just indicate something is "wrong" but also indicate what you believe it should be and be very specific. I realize some of the above may raise questions, hence getting my hands on a copy of the catalogue will be very useful (especially related to the collars I guess... that'll raise some eyebrows:))

aha, i had not noticed or thought of that:) effect is the same:)

By the way, www.sangiorgioaste.com is auctioning off some interesting items... they are spread out across the online catalogue so you have to look around a bit.

Given there is no seperate Albania section (pre socialist) and not being entirely altruistic, i just find it useful to not have to search each time. Will be making a post after my return from Belgrade in here as well. Would like to get to a clear (?) comprehensive list of all pre-socialist awards. Reading the threads and other sites, it just is not clear for me. Wied era medals http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=33865&st=80 Facist militia http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=41948 Collar of Albania http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=34967 Italy medals relating to Albania http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=35151 Italian army in Albania http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=34307 King Albert collier http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=34942 The Accession of Wilhelm of Weid medal http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=8404 Bust of King Zog http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=34453 Black Eagle Order http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=32035 Red Cross Medal http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=20563 Order of the Black Eagle http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=2724

Here's another Albanian King you may not be aware of yet: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Witte

excellent, looking forward to see scans (especially the document!)

will try to post a blow up of the key text

Visited Kaliningrad last week. Very, very cold... but also very interesting. A city with a fascinating history (German) and - despite the destruction during/after the war - it is still interesting today. One of the places visited was the Museum of History/Art which contained an interesting section with Militaria incl. 2 awards to the museum (or the city?). Anybody able/willing to translate? Also of note for militaria lovers is the (recently opened) naval city of Baltysk. A key port for the Soviet Baltic fleet with a very interesting naval museum. May post a few more pics in coming days.

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=42122 Post in above thread to express your support of a seperate dedicated DPRK area!

An interesting early Polar Star for sale on collectrussia... hand engraved mintmark on reverse

Recession? What recession? Screwback nr 607 for sale on collectrussia.com for 4900 USD

I've received my copy of the book as well. Without any reservation: this is a SUPERB book. A wealth of information in here, extremely comprehensive, and beautifully published. For anyone with even a slight interest in DPRK awards I can HIGHLY recommend to get this book. It clearly sets the standard for many years to come. I doubt it will be surpassed unless DPRK government itself develops and publishes a book. I've only flipped through the pages briefly as this one clearly requires sitting down with a warm cup of tea on a rainy sunday and spending an entire day to read through it. This book belongs in any collection of people interested in socialist awards.

Interesting ribbon bar: cloth underneath (so NOT painted), but plastic on top. First time i've seen that. Also an interesting combination... with the rare unselfishness medal.

Sent it off to Alexei for an attempt at research. Hope something (anything!) comes out... Any other different channels to try?

And finally, the missing page 12. Googling some of the names on this big 14 page list may give some interesting finds. Choydogsurenguiyn Danzanbaljyr – secretary of the Military School of the Party Committee Sanjiyn Ser-Od – colonel Butachiyn Guendenpil – colonel Bayiaryn Tovd – colonel Lamjavyn Horloo – colonel Chimediyn Anard – lieutenant colonel Tsesrenguiyn Senguee – colonel Choyloyn Choynzon – major Sampiliyn Mendel – major Vanchiguiyn Dovdon – lieutenant colonel Chimbeeguiyn Chuluun – captain Olziyn Chultem – lieutenant colonel Baldantserenguiyn Tsend – major Baljiryn Batsuh – colonel Biziyaaguiyn Baldan – captain Tsogdelgueriyn Tsevegmid – senior lieutenant Nyamyn Suren – major Chultemiyn Ul-Oldoh – major Tomoriyn Bat-Ochir – lieutenant colonel Guembeliyn Dugarsuren – lieutenant colonel Naranguiyn Demberel – captain Urtnasanguiyn Dulbaa – captain Mieviyn Banzragch – colonel Sandaguiyn Sanjmyatav – lieutenant colonel Sayjrakhyn Gangaanyiam – lieutenant colonel Luvsangombyn Molomjamts – major Galsansanzayn Makhbariad – major Danmdinjavyn Suren – lieutenant colonel Sanduyjavyn Choyjil – colonel Ludeviyn Sereenin – major Baataryn Dashdeleg – colonel Davaaguiyn Batochir – lieutenant colonel Olziyhutaguiyn Senguee – junior lieutenant Lhamhuuguiyn Nemdag – lieutenant colonel Mishiguiyn Navanjantsan – lieutenant colonel

Page 6 Guelegbarmidyn Vandan – referent Dampilyn Dagjid – retired lieutenant colonel Myatavyn Odsuren – retired colonel Dendeviyn Gombodorj – retired colonel Choyjooguiyn Yanjiv – retired lieutenant colonel Dendeviyn Legden – retired colonel Mordondoguiyn Tseren – radiologist Novovyn Molom – retired lieutenant colonel Dendeviyn Jamsran – colonel Jamyiaguiyn Zunduy – major Galsantserenguiyn Luvsan – former commissar of the armoured brigade Chultemiyn Bataa – retired lieutenant colonel Dendeviyn Jambaa – lieutenant colonel Tseveeniy Dolgorsuen – retired colonel Badamyn Bayarhuu – retired colonel Dorjiyn Sanjaa – retired colonel Tserendorjiyn Luvsandambu – major Tsedeviyn Badam – nurse Chimediyn Tsend – lieutenant colonel Raajavyn Choyjiljav – lieutenant colonel Jambalyn Rentsendorj – lieutenant colonel Gundiyn Nanzayhuu – lieutenant colonel Suuriyn Baldan – retired major general Gombosurenguiyn Namdavsuren – colonel Tsevegdorjiyn Chultem – pensioner Anduuguiyn Tumen-Olziy – lieutenant colonel Baataryn Sosorbaram – retired colonel Pagamyn Jambal – retired lieutenant colonel Suhbaataryn Gombojav – retired lieutenant colonel Minjuuriyn Damjin – retired lieutenant colonel Tsoguiyn Guennadiy – lieutenant colonel Olzvoyn Gotov – driver Jalsrayn Purevdorj – major Dorjiyn Namjil – lieutenant colonel

Yes, it did seem like some doc's were missing as well as awards (e.g. shouldn't there have been a dimitrov with the same year of awarding as the hero star?)

Does anybody here have any insight / information on the post-revolutionary titles "Determined Hero" (sometimes also mentioned as "Firm Hero")? I suspect this pre-dated the Hero titles as we know them (and perhaps didn't come with a gold star) and am wondering who/how/what regarding this title.