hunyadi Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 Here is a medal bar that I picked up - I need to know from what state it would be from - and if the ribbons are correct with the medals - I know the WW1 commemorative cross w/ swords is OK - but not cetrain about the others - I think an EK goes next to it? Perhaps its a 'put-together' but the hardware and the construction all look quite old (not aged!) Please tell me some history! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacky Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 (edited) Hi Hunyadi,the friedrich august medals are from saxon, If I'm correct, the bronze friedrich august medal is on the war ribbon, the other must be a ribbon black with two thin stripes on the sides..... if non war, but if war ribbon, the silver one should be ahead of the bronze one.....*just doing this from my memorie, you know it's sunday thus it might be failing...*The ribbons look pretty old,have you already tried blacklighting?? If the ribbons are glowing... alas, no good...Don't know too much about this, one of the experts will perhaps correct me and teach us the right story.Kind regards,Jacky Edited February 25, 2007 by Jacky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Y Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 You're right about the first FAM being on the Kriegsband, but yes, the middle one's mismatched. Should be an EK. The Bronze and Silver FAM's use the same ribbon and the peacetime ribbon is yellow with 2 wide and one narrow central black stripes. The wear on the FAM ribon looks different htan the EK and HK, but that could be due to the difference in weave. I'd move the silver over to give it a little more class and slap an EKII in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacky Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 If one looks at the reverse of the bronze one....this one appears to have been broken and soldeered recently......Might be a modern bar, just cheered up and rumbled with....thus moving the silver one over and slapping a EK II in between might seem strange, but this one had already been rumbled with...So no harm could have been done to this one, it only would look far better!!!!Kind regardsJacky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerd Becker Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 (edited) I think, the bar itself is okay. Its mounted in a Saxon Style with Saxon awards first, nothing unusual. On first place belongs the Bronze FAM in my opinion and on second an EK, like Tom already said. If he had the Silver FAM, wouldn?t he wear both then? Edited February 25, 2007 by Gerd Becker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunyadi Posted February 25, 2007 Author Share Posted February 25, 2007 WOW - thanks for all the information. When checked against black light the ribbons nor any part of it glows. I could tell from the texture and the age of the ribbons that they are period, probably interwar of course. I yanked the bronze off as its ring has been dinkered with - but it looks like an old repair. Dont know why they did a parallel repair when it should be a perpendicular - but in the interest of quality, I hung the silver first. If that is not regulation with Saxon bars - let me know and the bronze will go in its place - I think the silver came from another bar as it had the little 'sew-in' tab for other style bars hanging on it - its a great thing too as I have a EK,HK combo that is missing this very device for the EK. Now - need to get another EK.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landsknechte Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 I think, the bar itself is okay. Its mounted in a Saxon Style with Saxon awards first, nothing unusual. On first place belongs the Bronze FAM in my opinion and on second an EK, like Tom already said. If he had the Silver FAM, wouldn?t he wear both then?This one makes me nervous. A recepient of both grades of the FAM would have been entitled to wear both, and the EK would have been in first place after 1934 when the Hindenburg Cross came on the scene. Saxons wearing their awards first is nothing unusual for wartime bars, the Bavarians did it too. However for a bar of this vintage?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 This is absolutely fine for that brief 1934-35 period before the Iron Cross was decreed "always first" as the universal award of WW1. There is now no way to tell whether a bronze or a silver FAM went on this--always a problem with hook-back medal bars--but either could have been worn alone with an EK2 by a former junior enlisted man.Chances are the wearer removed his medals from this when the regulations changed in 1935 and remounted them again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landsknechte Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 This is absolutely fine for that brief 1934-35 period before the Iron Cross was decreed "always first" as the universal award of WW1. There is now no way to tell whether a bronze or a silver FAM went on this--always a problem with hook-back medal bars--but either could have been worn alone with an EK2 by a former junior enlisted man.Chances are the wearer removed his medals from this when the regulations changed in 1935 and remounted them again.Was it a matter of the silver and bronze FAM being not being awarded sequentially, or the soldier choosing to wear the highest grade? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 As initial awards, they were given by RANK. So a private or Gefreiter would get a bronze, while a Vizefeldwebel would get a silver, and so on. As a SECOND award, the junior rankers could get the silver as a subsequent award, while senior NCOs tended to get something like the General Decoration with Swords as a followup award.All rather odd, since Saxony had the very "American" practice of awarding their Saint Henry awards for a single heroic act regardless of any other awards being held-- or not. I've got original statutes for the FAMs, handed out when every medal was presented. Per the amendment of 8 April 1910, a "subsequent" award of a Silver was SUPPOSED to require returning the Bronze to the Orders Chancery. This was, of course, quite unfair, and was struck down by another amendment on 22 May 1916. Thereafter BOTH medals could be worn together IF they had both been bestowed on the war ribbons. In any case, it is entirely possible that either medal could have been the "lone" one worn here before the EK and HKX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saschaw Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 The bar seems fair, and a Silver FAM can be worn - all as Rick explained. [...] while senior NCOs tended to get something like the General Decoration with Swords as a followup award. My apologize Rick, but in this point you seem unaware. This boy on the right isn't "senior" at all, is he?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saschaw Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 Hmm, I hope everybody got that I've been kidding, Rick is not unaware for sure - I just wanted to show you my favorite Saxon Photo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacky Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 IF war had lasted longer, one would have found babies at the front,crying the heart of the enemy out instead of shooting them down ............Kind regards,Jacky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunyadi Posted February 26, 2007 Author Share Posted February 26, 2007 To everyone - thanks - for what I paid for it - even dinkered with... its still a nice one for the display cabinet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimZ Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 one would have found babies at the front,Yep....and in that case the sword would actually have been longer than the soldier!! Sachaw, could you say soemthing more about that photo? I find it most intriguing!Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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