Stogieman Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 OK Boils & Germs, Quiz time!! Is it a Good Bar, or a bad?Why??
Guest Rick Research Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 Unless Very Senior Beamter Indeed and PRE-1920.Show us the back, can you Evil Ricky?Is it BLUE?
HeikoGrusdat Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 N?3 is Landwehr.......why not......... N?4 + N?5 are steel medals for home involvation..............why not .....................N?2 is peacetime civil order..........why not............and N?1 is a noncom 1914............why notwhat has Rick in his head to tell................?
HeikoGrusdat Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 and the back is...................................................RED
Claudio Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 First of all, before saying anything, a bar, especially if it has such valuble orders like RAO 3. Kl. mit Schleife, should be inspected personally and have a UV-Light test. In this case the medal bar seems to be very well and correctly mounted and the construction seems alright, however from these out of focus pictures is difficult to tell. It seems also that the Landwehr-Medaille wasn't fooled with. Maybe like Rick L. said the wearer of this bar could have been an old guy who just wanted his medals to be put together later (after 1913). Maybe he was wearing a DA-Schnalle before. Nichtk?mpfer-Colonial medals and Nichtk?mpfer EK look quite consistent. I really like to see it in person... if it is not a Godet bar (see back), any juweller or dealer could have mounted... even today. I don't want to sound paranoid, but but parts of bars (ribbons, medal supporst, needle) can be easely found on the marked (Ebay).The only very bad thing of this bar is, if also we could say that is original, it will be quite impossible to research the medal bar owner's name.Ciao,Claudio
Ulsterman Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 #3 is primarily an enlisted mans' medal-and a man who got an REO3 would have spent time as an officer dL-Germany was a more status conscious society in them days. An REO with a bow implies a university degree and more senior job status-hence my caution.
saschaw Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 An REO with a bow implies a university degree and more senior job status-hence my caution. And presumably a KO2, doesn't it? If the awards a r e for civil merit, all can go. Here the major of Heidelberg: Landwehr long service IInd class, but yet some neck badges ...
Ulsterman Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 point taken, but wasn't the schnall worn by all ranks until the medal were created?
Stogieman Posted May 31, 2007 Author Posted May 31, 2007 Personally, I cannot see an RAO3, without a PCO. Never mind with the bow. The medal looks enlisted, the RAO3mS says "Officer", of some type to me...
Claudio Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 (edited) I have already seen a RAO mit Schleife without a PCO... I don't have any problems with it! Maybe he had a PCO 2. Kl., who knows? Edited May 31, 2007 by Claudio
Claudio Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 ... and I have already seen a Landwehr-DA 2. Kl. worn by officers...
saschaw Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 There are many, many RAO 3rd class with bow without a Crown Order on the bar, as many of those had a 2nd class - on the neck, of course.point taken, but wasn't the schnall worn by all ranks until the medal were created?The Landwehr-Dienstauszeichnung IInd class, Schnalle (pre1913) as well as the medal (post1913) were worn by all ranks, yes - but a high officer with REO 3rd class "should" have a long service awards Ist class ... There might be exceptions, and if he wasn't a military anymore when he got the REO then for civil merit, as I said - not problem with this.
Guest Rick Research Posted May 31, 2007 Posted May 31, 2007 Exactly. MOST Beamten seem to have put in the minimal time-- see Rank Lists-- that allowed them to swagger around with an officer's sword-- even if they were only "Leutnant der Landwehr aD" after their much much higher Beamten title. They put in the minimal time and QUIT the dR/dL duty-- hence no XX.LD2s were won and worn by all ranks--only the LD1 was SOLELY for officers.I expect this one had a Crown Order bumped up to the neck as well. Too bad about the red. I was hoping for blue since they are easier to check through.Just remember Standard Operating Procedure--if anybody finds him, do not post the name before the auction is OVER.I do think it is identifiable because there are NO OTHER medal bar grade awards from before the war on here. He was "pure Prussian."
Stogieman Posted May 31, 2007 Author Posted May 31, 2007 Hmmmm, I had neglected to consider the PCO2..... Thanks!
HeikoGrusdat Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 so it is yours now..... congrats!!! But please allow me one question............how did you pay the seller ?????? He did not want my money over the payment methods I offered to him....
Komtur Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 so it is yours now..... congrats!!! But please allow me one question............how did you pay the seller ?????? He did not want my money over the payment methods I offered to him.... I?ve sended Weddigens sub filled up with dimes (Sorry, wait a moment for a pm)
Komtur Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 Just remember Standard Operating Procedure--if anybody finds him, do not post the name before the auction is OVER.I do think it is identifiable because there are NO OTHER medal bar grade awards from before the war on here. He was "pure Prussian."The auction is over, and the pure Prussian is back home again. Unfortunately I havn?t got a clue of the Standard Operating Procedure So I need your help great masters of the rolls . I?m happy with this bar, but I?ll be more happy with a name to it. If someone want to send me to haeven, please find out, he was someone of the imperial medical service With regards, Komtur.
Komtur Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 (edited) Very nice bar indeed... it looks even better now! Yes, I?m really glad with it. It is quite similar to the one you catched before my nose on the last Thies-auction Edited June 15, 2007 by Komtur
Guest Rick Research Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 Ahhhhhhhhh what a splendid Beamter-General bar!He has GOT to be identifiable somehow. USUALLY a "pure Prussian" with "invisible" stay at home steel campaign medals would be hopeless-- for a lower rank, and a regular officer. But in THIS case, for a Beamter as senior as this (certainly with a Crown Order 2nd Class moved up and off his medal bar from a 3rd) to NOT have any other medal-bar grade awards should ELIMINATE possible suspects.
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