Chris Boonzaier Posted June 5, 2007 Share Posted June 5, 2007 Will we ever REALLY know who made what cross....I get the feeling that all the WW1 losts of makers are simply guessed.i.e. we see a ring stamp, and by chance know a matchiing maker/Jeweller name.... so suddenly "AB in a box" becomes Anton Brunhilde simply because we happen to put the two together....How many of the lits are really "right" ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buellmeister Posted June 5, 2007 Share Posted June 5, 2007 Chris, It is indeed an interesting topic. Honestly, I often as myself why are there so many unknown Manufacturers with EK's? Is there no documentation at all indicating whom made what? Have they arisen when the war needed them and couldnt sustain themselves after the Versailles Treaty and then got obscured in History? Those in the know are you able to shed some more light on this subject?Regards,Joel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve campbell Posted June 5, 2007 Share Posted June 5, 2007 I've always wondered this myself. How is such a common maker like KAG unknown? How are so many unknown? There seems to be a lot of knowledge about other aspects of these items, yet most makers are unknown. How was it determined that Fr is Friedlander and FR is Frank & Reif? Yet F is unknown? I'm sure there are some that can be positivley ID'ed but what about the rest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Boonzaier Posted June 5, 2007 Author Share Posted June 5, 2007 I've always wondered this myself. How is such a common maker like KAG unknown? How are so many unknown? There seems to be a lot of knowledge about other aspects of these items, yet most makers are unknown. How was it determined that Fr is Friedlander and FR is Frank & Reif? Yet F is unknown? I'm sure there are some that can be positivley ID'ed but what about the rest?Hi,not so long ago a phonecall to Frank and Reif determined that 1) they did not make WW1 EKs, 2) the company did not exist under the name back in WW1.So we can even knock the FR out of the equation.Another thing to factor in....Many pieces were assembled by Jewellers...Did they stamp their own rims? Did they order them from a stamping firm?Did a company who stamped out silver rims also cast iron centers for the cross? it is two different kinds of process.....Could it be that there were rim wholesales and iron center wholesalers and companys who bought and assembled the parts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve campbell Posted June 5, 2007 Share Posted June 5, 2007 I like the fact that you made a phone call. That's dedication. Could it have been another firm with the same name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Boonzaier Posted June 5, 2007 Author Share Posted June 5, 2007 Could it have been another firm with the same name?Hi,I am pretty confident that someone just matched a FR from a cross to a name they had heard in connection with stamped WW2 badges.Frank and Reif is a stamping company who stamped out badges in WW2, they did not have the skills to do EKs even then.bestChris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve campbell Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 Yes I think they made Panzer Assualt badges and Infantry Assualt badges. Things like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buellmeister Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 Interesting... I actually emailed the Jeweler WILM and congratulated them on their fine craftmanship on there Imperial EK's. Funny I know, but I'm still waiting for a response.. LOL! I'll doubt that ever will arrive... Wishful thinking. Different Times, different Generation running the Business....Regards,Joel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve campbell Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 Wilm is still out there? That's pretty interesting. They may have some information, maybe even some old examples from the firms history. Why not, we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buellmeister Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 True. I guess I would love just a nice signed letter of acknowledgement that I'd frame with one of their Crosses. Kind of an expose' of the Past and the Present. LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve campbell Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 What other makers are still around I wonder? How about the firms from WW2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buellmeister Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 Steve, Not certain on answering your question. I'd be curious to know myself on that one. Those in the know the floor is your's.Regards,Joel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biro Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 ....I am pretty confident that someone just matched a FR from a cross to a name they had heard in connection with stamped WW2 badges...Hi ChrisFor the record, Freidlander are one of three official suppliers of the PLM - and their PLM's are marked 'FR' (both letters in capitals).The fact that Freidlanders PLM's are almost certainly made by Wagner and supplied to Freidlander, yet bare the Freidlander mark, merely illustrates how convoluted the whole manufacturer vs jeweller subject is.Multiply the mystery to the power of ten when considering that even the EK's of firms whose history, size and status imply true manufacturer status (Wagner for example) can generally be found with at least two different core types, sometimes as many as four.Marshall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve campbell Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 Interesting topic considering maker marks are one of the main driving forces behind collecting, especially when people collect multiple examples of the same award. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now