Soviet Hero star and lenin order

[Ken M]

Hello Gentlemen;

I have just been directed to this excellent venue and have newly joined.

I am contemplating purchasing these two medals. They have a little red book in which both are entered and numbered. They were awarded at the same time.

I am fairly new to collecting soviet orders but still I have good feelings about these and can see no red flags. These are the only pictures I have. Can anybody give any critique? Negitive or positive, I'd like to hear any opinion.

Thanks,

Ken

[Ken M]

A view of the rear of the HS

[Ken M]

A close up of the suspension

[Ken M]

Another shot of the rear

[Ken M]

A view of the Lenin order

[Ken M]

Here is a view of the rear of the lenin order.

The number of the star is 2959 and the Lenin is 16707. The awards were made together in january 15, 1944 and the seril numbers seem to be correct for this time. Again, any help would be appreciated.

[Guest Rick Research]

What is the name in the Orders Book? And what other awards are entered in it?

There are references for Hero Stars, as well as the 1987 official biographies of all military recipients, so someone with those sources will be able to help you.

[Ken M]

What is the name in the Orders Book? And what other awards are entered in it?

There are references for Hero Stars, as well as the 1987 official biographies of all military recipients, so someone with those sources will be able to help you.

I took a photo of the page of the book listing the awards but didn't get the page that gives the fellows name. Here is a photo of the awards list page. It seems that he got the HS and the Lenin order together and then many others came later.

I have little doubt as to the authenticity of the book. It is the medals themselves that I would like to verify before considering this further.

Ken

Edited September 18, 2007 by Ken M

[Guest Rick Research]

That is a very strange combination of awards. When was this Book filled out? (actual date on bottom of the entry page).

No awards before a Hero Star... OK. Possible, I suppose. But none

at all

for the entire rest of the war?*

MMM in the vague 1945-47 range where serial numbers don't neatly match up to dates, presumably for long service.

ORS November 1950-January 1951 again presumably for 15 years long service (which would match up if the MMM was awarded in 1945)

But two initial Red Banners-- one in the 6 November 1947 long service Ukaz range and the other in the 30 December 1956 long service Ukaz range seemss

very very strange to me

*along with a Suvorov 3rd Class thrown in there at top.

You REALLY need to have this matched up with his 1987 biography, by name. This seems to be a VERY peculiar career for a wartime junior officer.

It would be very interesting to see it verified.

[Ken M]

I made these photos while at a recent show where I met the fellow who has the two medals and the book for sale. It was sort of an impromptu photo shoot as I borrowed a friends camera.

I wish I'd had the presence of mind to photograph the name on the book.

But what I would really like to have addressed here is the originality of the orders themselves. Without the book, do they themselves appear to be correct?

[Ed_Haynes]

For something of this significance (and value), I'd think you'd want to stick with a reliable dealer, not just someone met "at a show". It is a minefield. If the book and derived career is so dubious, I'm not sure how to evaluate the ambiguous (to me) images. And not knowing the name . . . ???

If you want a hero pair (group?), there may be more certain options out there?

[Ken M]

I have confused the issue by either mis-speaking or not giving enough information. The seller is not really pushing a sale here. He is a collector who bought this group from one of the respected dealers some years ago. I wouldn't characterize him as just somebody I just met "at a show" although I did meet with him there and the medals may be purchased.

Of course, If I had the name, it may be helpful in verifying the book. The name is certainly not a secret. It is just that I neglected to take a photograph of it as I considered it more having to do with the issue regarding the book rather than the medals.

Dis-regarding the book just for the time being, is there anybody who may address the medals themselves?

I have been doing considerable comparison with photos of known originals that are found on the web. (particularly the excellent photos shown on the Mondor.narod web-site). It appears that the details of these medals are commensurate with the photos that I have seen of known originals. But I have no illusions as to my powers of perception. I am seeking any comment pertaining to the medals themselves. Do they appear genuine or is this not something that can be ascertained from the photos I am able to supply?

Ken

Edited September 18, 2007 by Ken M

[Ed_Haynes]

Good luck, Ken. And Mondovor is "sacred text" ("sacred website"?).

We seem to have lost some forum members who could speak to this with great authority.

Though I'm not sure we can, or should, disregard the book.

[Christophe]

Here is your man... Have a look at his orders (including the Suvorov 3rd Class). My russian is not good enough to help more...

Cheers.

Ch.

[slava1stclass]

Here is your man... Have a look at his orders (including the Suvorov 3rd Class). My russian is not good enough to help more...

Cheers.

Ch.

To all:

While the feat that earned him his HSU and Lenin represents one of the hundreds awarded for the Dnieper river crossing, this bio entry certainly nails the Ordenskaya Knizhka dead to rights!

Regards,

slava1stclass

Edited September 18, 2007 by slava1stclass

[Christophe]

Yes, as far as I can see, seems right...

Cheers.

Ch.

[Christophe]

BTW, would be nice to see a pic of the entire page...

Ch.

[Ferdinand]

So, his name is Vasily Petrovich Khromykh; born on 26 Oct 1910, died on 10 May 1979. HSU on 15 Jan 1944. He was a Guards Captain and batallion commander in 239th Guards Rifle Regiment, 76th Guards Rifle Division, 61st Army, Central Front. On 28 sep 1943 his batallion crossed the Dnepr near the town of Mysy, established and defended a bridgehead and ensured the safe crossing of the regiment. His awards match the awards in the order booklet: HSU, Lenin, 2 Red Banner, Suvorov 3rd and Red Star.

[Guest Rick Research]

That's good, because those are an extremely peculiar combination-- and sequence-- of awards! In 13 years of studying Soviet groups, I've seen exactly two that had a lone Nevsky as wartime award, but this is the ONLY group I have ever seen with a Hero and a Suvorov to a junior officer without ANY of the "usual" awards. Certainly worth getting his Award Record Card to confirm the numbers and dates of all those other awards.

[Ken M]

Christophe:

Thank you VERY much. That is certainly much more information than I had before. I assume you have the book on the heros? Is there a photo of this man?

Now the $64 question: ASSUMING the medals themselves are good. What should be a ball-park price for this group? I have been shopping the net to see something to compare to but so far haven't had any luck.

Thank you everybody for your comments. You've all been most helpful.

Ken

[Christophe]

Ken,

Here's your man in photo.

Cheers.

Ch.

[Ken M]

Christophe:

Many thanks. Its nice to see there is a photo in the book.

I have decided to proceed with the purchase of this group. That being the case, I may go out and look for this 2 volume set myself.

Ken