EK 1939 Großmann or Deumer?

[George Stimson]

I have a few Deumer KVK 1s with the type of pin you are talking about. Let me take a look at them....

[RICK SCHMID]

I hope it's so easy......OK,I belive it's a "Deumer",but what can we say for shure? The frame and the core are manufactured by "Deumer".And we know that there are KvK's made by "Deumer" with the same pin and hinge.But who has it put together? Who knows........ .Another funny thing-you all knows the EKs with these big"sunburst" screwback? I've seen one with the same core and frame like our "suspects" here....but this is another vstory!

Regards

Micha

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If it's of any intrest I have crosses that have the same manufacturers # but have slight differencies with the cores, finish, dates and swazs. I thought it was my imagination but since I can't photograph with close up pics, I have to rely on a 20x lope and memory. I believe that sub assy. materials (cores) were exchanged (sold) to other mfgs.

Does anyone have any further info. on this subject?

thanks Rick Schmid

[George Stimson]

Here's a comparison of the hardware on an "11" marked Grossmann EK 1 and two Deumer KVKs. At first glance they all appear very similar.

[George Stimson]

But I feel that there are more differences than similarities. Here's the catch on the "11" EK. It's attached directly to the back of the cross.

[George Stimson]

The catch on this Deumer KVK is first attached to a plate before being attach to the cross. All of the Deumer KVKs that I own -- five or six -- have this feature.

[George Stimson]

Here's the hinge on the "11" EK 1. Like the EK catch, it is attached directly to the cross, without a mounting plate.

[George Stimson]

And here is the hinge on one of the KVKs. Like the KVK catches, it is mounted on the cross with a plate. And again, all of my Deumer KVKs have this feature. The hinges themselves are different as well.

[George Stimson]

Here's a side view of the EK and KVK hinges which better shows the difference between them.

[Motorhead]

Well,that's a knock out......so this trace ended nowhere! But thank you for spending your time to make this pics(and you saved my money-I would have bought one just to look....).Da steh ich nun ich armer Thor,und bin so schlau als wie zuvor(Goethe's Faust)

[Motorhead]

So no one else want to join this?

[Rosenberg]

Although this is a very interesting topic,I think it requires a bit of in-depth knowledge to take part in discussion.(I for one don?t even have neither EK nor KVK of the MM in question,apart from my serious lack of knowledge...)

Regards

[Bill Garvy]

Dan,

You are being modest. You know quite a lot.

Regardless, I have a question about the cross I displayed on the 1st page, posts 1 & 2. Although the core appears to be brass, the core itself is magnetic. I am going out a limb here and hypothesize the core is actually copper plated iron. I'd really like to hear some other thoughts. . .

[joe campbell]

william-

that would certainly explain the appearance

and the magnetism.

i haven't heard of it before, but that means little.

could this be purposefully constructed to ward off

the evil ocean salts??? (an old theory raises its

ugly head again... wish i could do a visual on that line.)

joe

[Motorhead]

Bill,

I'm not shure this is copper plated-the loss of the black paint happened not yesterday or the week before-so if there would be really copper under it,shouldn't it show some greenish corrosion? I think it was posible blued before(but it wouldn't make sense-that would be no protection at all) or coated with something else....another kind of paint? Well,I'm open to anything.......Or it's just normal corrosion at the bare core?(This is my favourite theorie at the moment)...

But to get back to the question(D.or G.)-Gei?ler is writing in his book that Deumers where produced with that special pin and the marking "11"-Does somebody know where he get's his information from?

Micha

[Motorhead]

Gentlemen-I think since tha last DN update the case is clear!

Micha