New Prussian minis

[Peter J]

I trying to figure out what type this Milit?rverdienstkreuz is. The Kronenorder is for comparison (14.5mm).

chers

Peter

[Paul C]

I think it maybe a long service cross for 20 years.

[Peter J]

Thanks Paul, I've just illustrated my ignorence . Should have known it was too good to be true

cheers

Peter

[saschaw]

Gentlemen?!

This is a "Kreuz des Allgemeinen Ehrenzeichens", a Prussian civil award from 1900 to 1918 era. It could be found in the OEK as #1837.

[Guest Rick Research]

It was usually the second award for NCO-level lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng service whether civil or military before the World War, after the General Decoration Medal in Silver. Usually seems to have come for 30 to 40 years of service, though it is actually far more uncommon than that would suggest.

The late Eric Ludvigsen counted 13,268 to January 1913 (the last Prussian awards annual) These were only being awarded about 2,000 times a year just before the war started. If awards to civil servants continued at that rate for all of the war years, then add another 10,000 as a guesstimate. But I don't think I've seen 30 of them in as many years.

[saschaw]

I guess the WWI awards of the "Kreuz des Allgemeinen Ehrenzeichens" are very low as in 1912 the "Verdienstkreuz in Silber" and "Verdienstkreuz in Gold" (1912-1918) were founded and awarded for very similar "merit". My father has a medal bar with "Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen" and the "Verdienstkreuz in Gold", so I think the crosses might have been used instead of the "Kreuz des Allgemeinen Ehrenzeichens", which makes actually all three not too common. They are expecially hard to find in mounted groups, singles are more common.

[Peter J]

Thanks for the input gentlemen

cheers

Peter

[Guest Rick Research]

This is the one lone ribbon bar I have (from David S's collection ) with the Cross of the General Decoration, General Decoration Medal, and one of the Prussian military long service awards

The wearer must have been some sort of uniformed civil servant since there is no Centenary Medal ribbon.

Sasha-- you know, I think you are right! I always wondered why the two NEW Crosses were created when this one already existed. I've never seen the Cross of the GenDec and one of the new Crosses together in a group. I have seen a number of groups with the new Crosses but no GenDec Medal, which has always confused me--we never see the award documents that would explain who/what the recipients were!

[Wild Card]

Gentlemen,

Since this thread has drifted from Peter J?s really fine (quality) minis, to a discussion of the silver merit cross, and since no full size examples have been offered, I thought that some of you might like to see some.

Unfortunately, the only one I have ever owned was sold some years ago; but in searching the Ludvigsen Archives, I have found two examples which, typical of Eric, are not just the standard basic thing.

First, we have a cross with a 60 year jubilee button.

[Wild Card]

According to Nimmergut, these crosses were awarded with 50, 60, 65 and 70 year jubilee buttons.

[Wild Card]

Next, we have one of the 160 crosses which were awarded with the crown.

[Wild Card]

Reverse.

[Ralph A]

I forgot I had this... it's been hanging from this lamp switch for ages!

[Ralph A]

Obverse.

[Ralph A]

reverse.

[Ralph A]

reverse that.

[saschaw]

Thanks for showing Gentlemen, three nice and interresting crosses.

Sasha-- you know, I think you are right! [...] I've never seen the Cross of the GenDec and one of the new Crosses together in a group.

I found one !!!

Sold on eBay by a seller called "am-militaria" ...

[Guest Rick Research]

Don't be naughty!

I meant I've never seen a REAL combination like that.

And I still haven't.

(They just can't STOP THEMSELVES from using AUSTRIAN 40mm ribbon minis on GERMAN bars. )

[VtwinVince]

Hey, I don't have anything like that hanging from my lamp.....this is an underappreciated award. I was fortunate to acquire one on a mounted group at a DNW auction last year.