1848 Schleswig Holstein Veterans

[Djedj]

Bonjour,

Introducing some Veterans of the 1848 Schleswig war - as pictured in 1908, I guess for the 60th Birthday of the formation of the provisory government in the Duchy. :

A close up on some grumpy old men with their medals - I guess Veteran Associations stuff ?

The back of the Cabinet Card features a menu - and a somewhat emphatic poem.

Now this Cabinet Card came to me through a lot ; though I appreciate the document, it's not my collecting at all.

So, to keep with the Season's Spirit, if anyone has a special interest in that campaign/medals/grumpy old men, I'll be happy to send it over to add to your collection (as in "for free").

Just please let it be known why you'd be interested, so that, in the (unlikely?) event a few of you are interested, I can chose the best retiring place for those old warriors !

Cheers,

Jerome

[speedytop]

Hi Jerome,

an interesting picture.

There are two pieces in my collection, belonging to this "event"

First a watercolour in a golden frame, with the coat of arms of Schleswig-Holstein and a wording like that on your picture "Up ewig ungedeelt!" = Undivided forever!

Second a cased medal for the veterans from Brunswick (Braunschweig), fighting in that war 1848/1849 for an undivided Schleswig and Holstein, awarded 1891.

Reverse:

Regards

Uwe

[Ulsterman]

Nice medal.

I collect grumpy old men and would be happy to give it a fine home!

here's another grumpy man-

[Djedj]

Bonsoir Uwe and Ulsterman,

Two good cases indeed !

Let's see if anyone else comes forward - I'll consult these elderly gents tomorrow, to ask them where they're rather retire.

Cheers,

Jerome

[joerookery]

These wars have fascinated me. I have just have a hard time finding sources that do not contradict each other. It seems as though many histories borrow ideas from the one written before it. So the story gets watered down a bit. I had to chase down the province of Lauenburg forever. I am still not sure what all the special privileges were in there was some point in time where the province was considered equal in title only with Prussia. So if this interests anyone... here are a couple of thoughts from a grumpy old man.

In 1815, the province of Holstein was admitted to the German Confederation, because the population was ethnically German. In this way, the Danish king became part of the German Confederation. Schleswig, in contrast was 50% Danish, had never been part of the Holy Roman Empire and was considered an integral part of the Danish kingdom by the Danes. There were also three provinces involved. The third one was called Lauenburg, and was often considered a small add-on to Holstein. There was a pre-1850 movement within Denmark to create an independent state named Schleswig-Holstein. Denmark objected, offered independence to Holstein, but insisted that Schleswig be closely tied to Denmark and to eliminate Schleswig?s home rule and linguistic privileges. In 1850, the German Confederation asked Prussia to police Danish ideas in this region. Prussia was successful, and though the three provinces remained part of Denmark, they were all allowed local autonomy.

Lauenburg (1848-1865), a duchy of Germany, formerly belonging with Holstein to Denmark, but from 1865 to Prussia. In 1848, during the first war between Prussia and Denmark, Lauenburg was occupied at her own request by some Hanoverian troops, and was then administered for three years under the German Confederation. Denmark incorporated the duchy in 1853. After the war of 1864 between Denmark and Prussia/Austria Lauenburg was ceded with Schleswig and Holstein to the two powers. By the convention of Gastein (14th of August 1865) Austria surrendered her claim over Lauenburg to Prussia in return for the payment of nearly ?300,000. Lauenburg entered the North German confederation in 1866 and the new German empire in 1871. Lauenburg retained its constitution and its special privileges until the 1st of July 1876, when it was incorporated into the kingdom of Prussia.

[Ulsterman]

BY the way- I love you website there- I think your unidentified Hussar Colonel is a Hungarian @ 1850s -perhaps one of the exiles from 1848. However, he MAY be Argentine!

Also-if you post that Hussar general here you'll identify him. Not too many had a PLM in 1870.

Also-is that a battle picture in the Indian army section of the artillery? It's a GREAT photo.

Edited December 13, 2007 by Ulsterman

[Djedj]

Bonjour Messieurs,

It took them some to get decided, but these old gents decided to go to a place that reminds them of when they were young, rather than reminding them they were old.

So Uwe Speedytop, I'll PM you for your address - that they're eager to reach !

Thanks for your comments gents - especially Ulsterman.

Btw, are you referring ("Unidentified Hussar Colonel") to this gentleman ?

He's been a puzzle for a while !

I gave the Hussar General a go on the forum a while ago ; sadly the Medals don't show out good enough for positive Id. - and I seem to remember the PLM was rather thought to be a Johanniter of some sort.

Cheers !

Jerome

[speedytop]

Hi Jerome,

thank you very much, the gents will have a good home for the rest of her life!

They are already expected:

Rough translation:

"Together we are intolerable!"

Kind Regards

Uwe

Edited December 15, 2007 by speedytop

[Ulsterman]

Bonjour Messieurs,

It took them some to get decided, but these old gents decided to go to a place that reminds them of when they were young, rather than reminding them they were old.

So Uwe Speedytop, I'll PM you for your address - that they're eager to reach !

Thanks for your comments gents - especially Ulsterman.

Btw, are you referring ("Unidentified Hussar Colonel") to this gentleman ?

He's been a puzzle for a while !

I gave the Hussar General a go on the forum a while ago ; sadly the Medals don't show out good enough for positive Id. - and I seem to remember the PLM was rather thought to be a Johanniter of some sort.

Cheers !

Jerome

Yup-the more I look at it I am wondering Spanish or maybe,just maybe South American. I am perusing my Paraguayan war books as I type.