Soviet The monument to the Soviet pilots is blown up. Afghanistan. Bagram. Air base.

[Sergey]

The American military authorities has destroyed a monument to the Soviet pilots to victims in Afghanistan. The monument was in memory of pilots 378 aviation shelf of victims in 1986-1987

[Kev in Deva]

Please post from where and when these facts were obtained.

Thank you.

Kevin in Deva.

[Christophe]

Hi Sergey,

What is your source about this ?

Cheers.

Ch.

[Christophe]

Hi Kevin,

Same remark, here...

Ch.

[Sergey]

These two sources russian-speaking.Vidio from the company of NTV In the first case the message of the American military man. It has addressed on Russian military site for the help. Now there are messages, that the monument nevertheless has been destroyed.

http://www.videostring.ru/report.php?id=7

http://www.forums.airforce.ru/printthread....t=615&pp=40

[Kev in Deva]

Is there any indication that this demolition has been undertaken at the request of the Afghanistan Government?

Seeing as the Soviet's were viewed as an invasion force.

Kevin in Deva.

[Sergey]

Всё-таки снесли. По версии для внутреннего пользования на американской авиабазе, вокруг памятника, где мы столь безмятежно снимали репортаж, нашли мины. Их уничтожили. Памятник списали как последствие. Не придерёшься. Да и не надо. Поорать ? дело патриотически воспалённых горлопанов. Если бы на Родине оставшиеся в живых жили как герои, словом и монетой за памятники вступились бы.

It was written by the author vidio. The official version-in time of mine clearing of territory there was an explosion mine the destroyed monument.But as the American soldiers speak goes expansion of road of air station. The monument prevents it to do

[Davehal9000]

Just found this site today and wondered if I'd find mention of the memorial here...

My name is David Keeley, one of the three that were fighting to save the memorial. I'm the one sown on the NTV report, in Newsweek Russia and in the Wall Street Journal article.

Unfortunately, yes, the memorial was destroyed. I had been told it had already been destroyed prior to my return to Bagram in '08. When i got there, however, it was still intact, but damaged. They'd attempted to move it but stopped when it began to crumble. A couple of weeks later the civilian deminning team tried again, destroying it.

At this point there was nothing we could have done. The area that housed the memorial was to be built up as part of a military construction project I cannot discuss here. Every inch of the ground surrounding it had been dug up, leaving this small island with the memorial on it. It looked to me like no one was able to make a decision about what to do. The US military couldn't bulldoze it. The Russians wanted to move it to the embassy at Kabul, but I believe there were issues with allowing them access to the base by the Afghanis. There was also talk of the cost of moving it but I think that's all speculation. The deminers took matters into their own hands, and the memorial is unfortunately destroyed.

It saddened me to see it destroyed. I feel regardless how you feel about an enemy in time of war, after the war has ended we're all human beings once again, men who fought to protect what was dear to us. It should have been preserved to honor these men who died in such a bloody war as a reminder of what happens when diplomacy fails and we send our sons off to fight.

[Sergey]

Just found this site today and wondered if I'd find mention of the memorial here...

My name is David Keeley, one of the three that were fighting to save the memorial. I'm the one sown on the NTV report, in Newsweek Russia and in the Wall Street Journal article.

Unfortunately, yes, the memorial was destroyed. I had been told it had already been destroyed prior to my return to Bagram in '08. When i got there, however, it was still intact, but damaged. They'd attempted to move it but stopped when it began to crumble. A couple of weeks later the civilian deminning team tried again, destroying it.

At this point there was nothing we could have done. The area that housed the memorial was to be built up as part of a military construction project I cannot discuss here. Every inch of the ground surrounding it had been dug up, leaving this small island with the memorial on it. It looked to me like no one was able to make a decision about what to do. The US military couldn't bulldoze it. The Russians wanted to move it to the embassy at Kabul, but I believe there were issues with allowing them access to the base by the Afghanis. There was also talk of the cost of moving it but I think that's all speculation. The deminers took matters into their own hands, and the memorial is unfortunately destroyed.

It saddened me to see it destroyed. I feel regardless how you feel about an enemy in time of war, after the war has ended we're all human beings once again, men who fought to protect what was dear to us. It should have been preserved to honor these men who died in such a bloody war as a reminder of what happens when diplomacy fails and we send our sons off to fight.

Has read this message. Thanks. It is the general memory of war.

War where Russian guys yesterday died, and the American guys today die.

[Davehal9000]

Is there any indication that this demolition has been undertaken at the request of the Afghanistan Government?

Seeing as the Soviet's were viewed as an invasion force.

Kevin in Deva.

This may not be the proper place to discuss this, but what the heck...

When I enlisted in the USAF 22 years ago is was to defend our nation against the Soviets. I lived my entire life knowing any minute some idiot, American, Soviet, or who knows, might push the button and end life on this planet. I lived the early days of my career as I did much of my life before the military, studying our enemy. I watched on TV as the Soviets roll into Afghanistan. I watched the news every night, read every article or book I could read about the subject. When I went to Afghanistan for the first time in 2006 I thought I had a pretty good understanding of the Soviet War in Afghanistan. I was wrong.

I went to Afghanistan expecting to hear horrible stories about the Soviets, but in reality I didn't hear those stories. Granted I didn't speak to the entire nation, but I did speak with people from various parts of Afghanistan, rich and poor, younger and old, etc. One good friend of mine's parents were executed by Soviet troops. That was the worst I heard. Another friend of mine served in the DRA. He fought along side Soviet troops in helping rid Afghanistan of the rebellion that was threatening their nation. He's a very well educated gentleman, and he looks upon the Soviets, now the Russians, as friends. He takes offense to any discussion otherwise.

Another gentleman was a DRA tanker. Again, he held the Soviet troops he served with in the highest regards. Another friend, who actively hunts Taliban for sport, was a teenager during the war. He said you stay away from the Soviet troops, their convoys and their check points and you had no problems. Do something stupid and they're going to react accordingly.

I know if you polled every Afghani who lived in those times you'd get a variety of stories ranging from high regard for the Soviets to labeling them as war criminals, but this was my experience. For those former Soviet soldiers and officers who served there, who showed compassion, treated people with respect, etc, while keeping your eye out for trouble, you left a positive image on a good portion of Afghan society, and some of these people are the ones doing the real, honest work to rebuild their nation.

[CCN]

Just curious, where on Bagram was this monument located?

[Doc Wilson]

I am surprised I was at bagram twice each for a week it was there in 2005/2006. Sorry.....

[RussianPilot]

The American military authorities has destroyed a monument to the Soviet pilots to victims in Afghanistan. The monument was in memory of pilots 378 aviation shelf of victims in 1986-1987

This is not exactly true.

The monument was discovered by US troops in 2006 with the move to Bagram. It had no pictures, no writings and the aircraft model was missing too. The structure was damaged. The locals said that when the russian troops were pulling back in 1989 they took all of that home and mined the area. The locals also mentined that the monument was not a grave - the pilots either went down with their airplanes or were sent home to be burried there.

The soldiers of the US engineering unit worked on the structure and made a model of the aircraft. Some guys spent their own time and money and wanted to fully restore the monument. This had coverage in the world press.

The Afghanees had a fit with it because they don't like russians very much and this was their soil, rented out to the US.

On the 22-nd of February 2007 the russian ambassador Kabulov visited the base and asked for the remains of the monument to be moved to the grounds of the russian embassy in Kabul, but he said "we don't have any means of arranging this".

The remains of the monument were moved to the south-east, closer to the sovier era buildings. They are basically a conrete wall and the tank fuel tanks filled with concrete as the foundation. This had to take place because the decision was made to build a new runway to the SE of the existing one and the monument was too close to the site.

The russian press picked up this story and described it as "the yanks blew up soviet pilots graves".

[RussianPilot]

I'd like to take a chance and tell you about one of the pilots. His picture is in the center of the monument.

His name is

Konstantin Pavlukov

.

He was born in

Siberia

, in the place called

Barnaul

.

He went to the Barnaul Air Force academy (class of 84) and later checked out in the SU-25.

He was ordered to

Afghanistan

in October 1986. He flew 70 sorties in the SU-25 as the attack or CAS pilot.

In the evening on

the 21st of January 1987

(4 months in combat) he was a wingman (2 of 2) on the flight that had a task of "clearing" the green shrub area to the W-NW of the Bagram Airfield. This was a routine procedure before a cargo airplane/s would takeoff or land. With the arrival of the Stinger missle in 1986 the russian air force started taking heavy losses and the SU-25's or helis would patrol at least the close to the airports areas looking for enemy during heavy departures or arrivals.

As Kostya's flight took off, while making a downwind turn, his aircraft was hit by a stinger. Kostya ejected. While descending he was shot at from all over the shrub area and most likely wounded. As soon as he landed he unpacked the combat pack – thank goodness our Wing Commander

Aleksander Rutskoy

had common sense to order to throw out the stupid floating rafts and put gun, ammo and a few grenades in the combat pack in the ejection seat that is tied to the pilot's shute harness.

Kostya engaged a group of probably around 20-30 mujahideen. They wanted to take him alive, but he fought until running out of ammo, for 30-40 minutes. This was taking place only 1.5-2 kilometers form the airfield. I don’t know why the rescue was so ineffective.

Kostya was heavily wounded. When a group of the enemy approached him he detonated a hand grenade in his hand..

He remained a soldier to the end. Kostya was 23 years old.

[Paul R]

It was a beautiful memorial, but it sounds as if it was almost unrecognizable as such by the time the Americans arrived.