question on red cross awards

[HeikoGrusdat]

Hi all,

here I have a 4 place medal bar and I must say that I don`t know anything about the 3.reich red cross medal on the right and not very much about the hanseatic red cross second from left... questions are:

- how often awarded?

- awarded to whom (what kind of persons)? higher or lower ranks?

- any lists of owners available?

any help is welcome, same for the red cross second from left, the hanseatic red cross. I have heard these ones were individually numbered? Any information on this cross is welcome as well, same questions as for the other medal...

thank you very much!!!

Heiko

PS: I will put this in the 3.reich AND the imperial section, hope to find some experts on this...

[Guest Rick Research]

The 1937-39 Red Cross Medal was given to ranks/status up to Oberleutnant level.

The Hanseatic ones WERE numbered-- I had one in a group (which did NOT unfortunately include the award document) to a fat, elderly bank teller who had been in the labor-corps Landsturm in WW1, got the PRUSSIAN one as his only war award in 1920 (though he had a Hindenburg Cross wX!) and served long years in the Red Cross between the wars-- as an ordinary volunteer.

If there were any rolls, I don't know about them.

[HeikoGrusdat]

Hello,

I can tell you in some days if there are marks on the back, it is just in the mail and on the way to me...

I try to find out who the owner was, therefore the questions. He must have been an old man in 1937/39 because I know 100% that he has got the red cross medal in 1901 - just the name is missing... but I have 21 names to choose from - but if there are no lists to compare the names are worth nothing, or?

thank you

Heiko

[HeikoGrusdat]

brandnew pictures of this bar and the ultra-rare clasp "S?dafrika 1899 1900" are here in this thread in the 1933-45 section "general awards"

ENJOY

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=3215

Heiko

Edited November 12, 2005 by HeikoGrusdat

[Pete A]

Heiko,

That's one nice looking bar you have there. And apparently quite rare with the clasp.

Can you (or somebody) tell what other clasps were instituted for the red cross medals? I assume they were all for the colonial campaigns? I know there was one for the boxer rebellion in China.

Pete

Edited November 13, 2005 by Pete A

[HeikoGrusdat]

there are only 2 clasps which are similar to the colonial medal and the china medal... it is "Peking" and "S?dwestafrika 1904/06" but these clasps for the red cross medal have different styles.

There were:

T?rkei 1897 (inofficial) - maybe 1

S?dafrika 1899/1900 - 30

Ostasien 1900/01 - 77

Peking - 5

Charbin 1904/05 - 10

S?dwestafrika 1904/06 - ca.105

rare pieces all of them...

Heiko

[Stogieman]

Why is there no Honor Cross on the bar? If he/she received either a combat, or a nc on combat ribbon EK2, how can we have 1 1938 3. Reich award yet no Honor Cross??

[HeikoGrusdat]

Rick, the honour cross came together with these bars and some red cross stickpins, it was simply not mounted on the bar, it is a honour cross without swords...

Heiko

[Stogieman]

ahhhhh, Thanks Heiko, I missed that detail!!

[Pete A]

there are only 2 clasps which are similar to the colonial medal and the china medal... it is "Peking" and "S?dwestafrika 1904/06" but these clasps for the red cross medal have different styles.

There were:

T?rkei 1897 (inofficial) - maybe 1

S?dafrika 1899/1900 - 30

Ostasien 1900/01 - 77

Peking - 5

Charbin 1904/05 - 10

S?dwestafrika 1904/06 - ca.105

rare pieces all of them...

Heiko

Thanks Heiko.

So were these only for the III. class or was the II. class possible too? And what if one already held a red cross medal, was the bar simply added to the old one, or was a second medal awarded?

Since the award numbers are so low, I assume that not every medical person involved got one? What was the criteria?

A lot of questions, hope you don't mind.

Pete

[HeikoGrusdat]

Hi Pete,

these clasps were only for the medical personal of the "medical volunteer service" (Freiwillige Krankenpflege). Only these few sanis or docs who went in the special crisis region got the bar...

2 x Ostasien and 5 x S?dwestafrika were for the second class, all others were for third class medals.

Some people (6) got 2 clasps and 1 got 3 clasps for several journeys...

If you still had the medal you could get a clasp to the medal later...

Heiko

[Chris Boonzaier]

Hi,

Do you have any info on german medics in the Boer war? I may have a few books somewhere where they are described.

best

Chris

[Pete A]

Hi Pete,

these clasps were only for the medical personal of the "medical volunteer service" (Freiwillige Krankenpflege). Only these few sanis or docs who went in the special crisis region got the bar...

2 x Ostasien and 5 x S?dwestafrika were for the second class, all others were for third class medals.

Some people (6) got 2 clasps and 1 got 3 clasps for several journeys...

If you still had the medal you could get a clasp to the medal later...

Heiko

It's all perfectly clear now. Thanks, Heiko!

Pete

[HeikoGrusdat]

Chris,

the german medics in boer war were:

proffesor:

-K?ttner

doctors:

- Flockemann

- Hildebrandt

- Matthiolius

- Ringel

- Stahmer

- Strehl

- Wieting

sanis:

- Ackermann

- Dietz

- Eckert

- Gudian

- Heuschkel

- Jaecks

- Kiessling

- Mantel

- Muuss

- Nagel

- Rachel

- Sack

- Spies

- Stabenow

nurses:

- B?tef?hr

- Heiler

- Held

- Lieberknecht

- Petrat

- Thiel

- Westphal

- Wittum

Heiko

[Leutwein]

Hello guys, (Hallo Heiko )

could this guy be one of the sanis?? The seller said that he took part on the Boer War and the last medal should be an english medal, is that correct??

It is possible that he took on the Boer War and Boxer War in China??

What kind of cross is the 6th one and what kind of medal is the turkish one?

Unfortunately is the name unknown.

All the best

Karsten

[Wild Card]

Hi Leutwein,

The 6th medal is Austrian. I do not know the proper name for it though; and, yes, the last medal does certainly appear to be British - most likely, if for the Boer War, the Queen?s South Africa Medal.

I do have to ask a question though. Given the rest of the group, why am I wrong in expecting the Iron Cross to be on a non combatants ribbon?

Best wishes,

Wild Card