Guest Rick Research Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 I am working on a huge already researched, but untranslated (me do that thing!) group, which the owner has agreed to share with us all here. But as I worked my way through and reached this, I thought this would make an interesting thread.Couple of rough spots (red underlined="...с контр-нaст пaющ(?ими?) 218..." also not sure of initial of the river's name because of the splotchy typing scan) I'm not precisely sure of, but see what YOU would have put in for (recommendation whited out)... and try to guess what was actually bestowed, for this self-propelled artillery regimental Commissar, a Major:[attachmentid=17716]?Major Belykh, V.T. on 30.4.44 in battle for the population points Kustich and Solovich, took personal combat leadership of two batteries and skillfully organized cooperation with counter instructions {? and unknown word here} of the 218th RifRgt of 77th GdsRifDiv and by violent counterattack of the second battery, the enemy was driven from population points Kustich and Solovich as far as the River (T?G?)ur?n.1.5.44 4 batteries of the 1205th Self-propelled ArtRgt combined with infantry of 218th RifRgt courageously struck and drove out the enemy from the suburb of Tuzhisk.In these actions?30.4.44 and 1.5.44?Comr. Belykh personally participated in resourceful combat leadership under battle conditions.For the successful operations of these two batteries, which were led by Comr. Belykh, the commander of the 77th GdsRifDiv, Major General {V.S.} Askalepov, in his order expressed the gratitude of his personal staff.For initiative and skillful leadership of combat operations, Comr. Belykh deserves to be awarded the State (BLANKED OUT nyah nyah nyah).(no day) June 1944, 25th Rifles Corps Commander of Political Matters, Col. ?A. Kropachev?Approved 6 June 1944, Commander of 25th Rifles Corps, Major General {A. B.} ?Barinov?Approved 17 June 1944, 69th Army Commander of Political Matters, Gds Col ?Vashinevsky?(no day) June 1944 69th Army commanders (NOT signed)8 July 1944 Per decree of 5 July of 69th Army, (BLANK) approved,? 2nd Dept CO, Major Illegible?
Chuck In Oregon Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 So, the commissar stepped up and took charge of two batteries and led a successful two-day counter-attack. That might earn an ordinary mid-level officer what, a Red Star? Your guy was a commissar and he was noticed by the division CO, which was probably good for both of them. I'm going to guess a Red Banner.Chuck
Guest Rick Research Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 If it had been a few months later into 1945, my own pick would have been a Nevsky(decisive success against superior forces)--but this is just BEFORE the 1944 summer offensive. And, if I am not reading wrong, he DISOBEYED orders and on his own authority countermanded somebody else's (possibly one of the soon to be very unlucky relieved, or possibly freshly K.I.A. battery commanders, or was it his own regimental commander--after all, not in the proposals processing--or a staff type from Division?) for a bit of Who Dares Wins. Lucky for HIM he DID win... or this might have resulted in some different paperwork! Soooo.... point blank urban artillery close (i.e. house to house) support for infantry, breaking the German lines... Let's see what else gets suggested-- and why.
Danny Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 If it had been a few months later into 1945, my own pick would have been a Nevsky(decisive success against superior forces)--but this is just BEFORE the 1944 summer offensive. And, if I am not reading wrong, he DISOBEYED orders and on his own authority countermanded somebody else's (possibly one of the soon to be very unlucky relieved, or possibly freshly K.I.A. battery commanders, or was it his own regimental commander--after all, not in the proposals processing--or a staff type from Division?) for a bit of Who Dares Wins. Lucky for HIM he DID win... or this might have resulted in some different paperwork! Soooo.... point blank urban artillery close (i.e. house to house) support for infantry, breaking the German lines... Let's see what else gets suggested-- and why.I'll go with OPW 1st Class. After all he did disobey orders but succesfully lead the counter-attack..... to think about it more, it would be this one or a Red banner.
NavyFCO Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 Rick-I don't believe that "counter instructions" is really the correct term. I am by no means an expert at Russian, but it seems to me that he led a forced (or pressed) counterattack against the German forces. It seems to me that perhaps the unit commander was KIA, he took over (as the commissar this would make sense) the troops had been falling back, and he "pressed" them into a counterattack that saved the day. That's how I would translate it. I really don't think that he disobeyed orders... something like that didn't get you nominated for awards!I really should know what award that he was nominated for since I used to own the group, but I can't remember off the top of my head and I'm not going to cheat by looking at photos of it on my hard drive! My best guess: Order of the Red BannerDave
Guest Rick Research Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 Splotchy typing (Get your awards researched NOW, people. This stuff ain't gonna be pretty in 50 more years and the mere thought of 873 trillion cubic tons of paper sitting in Podolsk....) The two problem words connecting with each other is what throws me off the translation trail there.
NavyFCO Posted December 1, 2005 Posted December 1, 2005 Splotchy typing I don't think it's so much the splotchy typing but the fact that the majority of these darn things are on the real thin (Rick, you know what it's called) type of paper that's almost translucent. That's why you get so many funky photocopies where the letters are backwards, there's signatures where typing should be and the like... because they are showing through from the backside! Many of these documents tend to "wrinkle" over time and thus they made for seriously crappy photocopies. Plus, it's not a far off guess to suppose that Padolsk isn't loaded with the most technologically advanced photocopiers... Dave
Bill Dienna Posted December 1, 2005 Posted December 1, 2005 I'm going to guess that the political oficer was Leonid Brezhnev.They gave him a Red Star.Forty years later, realizing the error of their ways, it was upgraded to the Order of Victory.A minor oversight at the time.
Bill Dienna Posted December 2, 2005 Posted December 2, 2005 Hey Rick!When do we get an answer to the mystery?
Stogieman Posted December 2, 2005 Posted December 2, 2005 I think he forgot that he left everybody hanging!
Gerd Becker Posted December 2, 2005 Posted December 2, 2005 I think he forgot that he left everybody hanging! Bear with him. He is just too busy playing with the toys, he has at home currently.
Guest Rick Research Posted December 3, 2005 Posted December 3, 2005 Yet another in an intermittently endless series of Really Bad Days here, guys, so haven't been around until now.That's IT? No more guesses? "All in?"Will reveal on Saturday.
Dudeman Posted December 3, 2005 Posted December 3, 2005 Your mystery word is "kontrnastupayushimi" (or counterattacking) modifying the two subsequent units.
Guest Rick Research Posted December 3, 2005 Posted December 3, 2005 Thanks for that! I shudder to think what these records will be like 100 years from now-- the paper is shoddy, they're bound sloppily, the copying is careless... and the handwriting and typing on the originals wasn't good to start with.Other than THAT!...OK:Since nobody else wants to play--Commissar Belykh was proposed for an Order of the Patriotic War 1st Class ( Danny!) and it went all the way up to 69th Army, where it was reduced to an OPW2. (69th Army would do that to him no less than three times!)Now a couple of months later into the summer 1944 offensive, and I could have seen this stretched to a Bogdan Khmelnitsky 3rd Class (initiative... small unit commander... capturing population area... penetrating enemy lines...) for liberating occupied areas;A Nevsky would still have been my choice (initiative ... decisive attack... superior enemy...);But as written, could also have been put in as a Kutusov 3rd (initiative... sudden, bold attack... neutralizing enemy delaying positions... capably developed battle plan, employing combined arms with successful outcome...).The confusion of What To Bestow may have been his "deputy regimental commander" status. He was actually "only" leading two companies here... so was he a deputy regimental commander, or a battlaion/company commander in these actions for the purpose of what actual role he played? In any event, He Was Robbed on THIS one of his six citations!The whole group is being saved for a lull in winter's postings. I'm all but through his personnel records and only have his last citation of WW2 left to do.
Stogieman Posted December 5, 2005 Posted December 5, 2005 Ahhh, he didn't forget about us. Seems that sometimes the award system for Soviet Commanders in WW2 was on a "gee, what mood am I in today" once it was kicked upstairs. I also find it interesting all the levels of "management" these citations went through.
Chuck In Oregon Posted December 5, 2005 Posted December 5, 2005 Ahhh, he didn't forget about us. Seems that sometimes the award system for Soviet Commanders in WW2 was on a "gee, what mood am I in today" once it was kicked upstairs. I also find it interesting all the levels of "management" these citations went through.* * * * *The Soviets certainly didn't invent bureaucracy, but they may have perfected its excesses. "Apparatchiki" is still a meaningful and commonly used word in the FSU. So is the lovely phrase for those who hide at headquarters while others do the real work: "Chancellery Mice". One of my personal favorites.Chuck
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