Help please with the imperial Germany officer photo

[Noor]

Hi guys,

I obtained today one interesting photo of the imperial Germany officer and few questions arrised.

First at his entire medal bar:

1. Order of the Red Eagle, Prussia

2. 1897 Prussian Jubilee medal

3. Order of Albert, Saxony

4. Order of the Star of Romania, officer grade

What grade would be the RAO? To me its look like 4th class?

Regarding the combination, I presume he is Prussian officer. But can someone ID his rank and uniform or maybe is even possible to find out a name ?

Checked and Romanian order is not common at all - officer grade was awarded 500 to civilians and 150 to military (1877-1932)

Any help would be great!

All the best,

Timo aka Noor

Edited July 15, 2010 by Noor

[HeikoGrusdat]

Timo,

anything written on the reverse ? A date ?

[Mike Dwyer]

Hi guys,

I obtained today one interesting photo of the imperial Germany officer and few questions arrised.

He appears to be a Major. Beyond that, I'm not sure. Those type of Litzen were used by Pioniere and Verkehrstruppen officers, also, I believe, War Ministry and General Staff officers.

The plain eppaulettes without numbers, cyphers, or other unit insignia imply he may be Pioneer, War Ministry or General Staff.

Edited July 15, 2010 by Mike Dwyer

[HeikoGrusdat]

This should be................

Königlich Sächsischer Major Schwertfeger , dem großen Generalstab zugeteilt , Lehrer an der Kriegsakademie

cheers

Heiko

[Noor]

Thanks Heiko and Mike for your help!

Great job with the name as well Heiko.... you are fast

I am sure Deurelle would love to see this

Edited July 15, 2010 by Noor

[HeikoGrusdat]

Fast ??? It took over 2 hours this time..................... ;)

[Deruelle]

Hi,

Very nice photo indeed.

Heiko has right about the name but it is a Prussian officer not a Saxon one. Great job heiko

Christophe

[KenS]

Is this him?

http://www.munzinger.de/search/portrait/Bernhard+Schwerdtfeger/0/1679.html

[HeikoGrusdat]

Hi Ken - yes it should be him...

Hi Christophe - I thought he was a saxon officer because in my ranklists he has a "KS" in front of his rank and name.... thought this means Königlich Sächsischer , I could not find him in many lists so I thought these were the only years he was in prussian service and the missing years he was in saxon service and must be found in their rank lists...

[Daniel Krause]

Nice pic of Schwertfeger!

Heiko, he is no Saxon, where do You have that from?

Munzlinger BTW is wrong. He retired as Colonel and got the MajGen promotion long after WW1.

Got additional KO3, EK1, SA3X, SMK, ÖM3K

Greetings

Daniel

[HeikoGrusdat]

Daniel , what does the " KS " in the ranklist in front of his rank and name mean???

[KenS]

The 1905 Rangliste shows him as a Captain at the Kriegsschule in Hannover (with the uniform of Saxon Foot Artillery Regiment No. 12) 24.6.03 F

[HeikoGrusdat]

Right.....and that`s why I was shure that "KS" means "Königlich Sächsischer"......

[Noor]

Great to see that one picture can bring some life back to this forum. I got home from work and after we got our son to sleep, open computer and vola... so many posts

Here is the new one from today what I got (on the way)

Medal bar:

1. EK2

2. ?????

3. Imperial Russia Order of St.Stanislaus 4th Class (looks like with the bow)

First at all what period uniform it is? If it is pre WW1 (what I presume) then the EK2 must be 1870 issue.

Also what would be his rank? Major as well?

Second award is to plury I afraid to ID it.

Any help would be appreciated!

Timo aka Noor

[HeikoGrusdat]

Ah intersting......... I was too slow on that one too........ need to raise my speed

N°2 is of course the 1870 medal , N°1 is a iron cross 2.class 1870.... from the type of paper I would say about 1875 - 1885 , Garde-Ulan (?) from Berlin..... I don`t have that early ranklists.... sorry

[Daniel Krause]

Which KS?

[HeikoGrusdat]

This KS here............. just thought I am going crazy - but it is still there...puuuuuu ;)

[HeikoGrusdat]

or this one.....

[Daniel Krause]

ahhhhh......thats ODDDDD!!!!!!

He was Saxon until 1912/13 and went straight in the Prussian Army as Major in General staff....

Usually the Saxons were "just" commanded to the Prussian institutions. Somehow he had a reason completely to swich over. I will check the Saxon Militärwochenblatt next days, maybe something turns up.

Greetings

Daniel

[KenS]

Ah intersting......... I was too slow on that one too........ need to raise my speed

N°2 is of course the 1870 medal , N°1 is a iron cross 2.class 1870.... from the type of paper I would say about 1875 - 1885 , Garde-Ulan (?) from Berlin..... I don`t have that early ranklists.... sorry

Info about the photographer:

http://www.zeno.org/Schmidt-1902/A/Hanfstaengl,+Franz

http://fotostudios.genealogy.net/details.php?ID=1364

http://books.google.ca/books?id=L23uWokRSj0C&pg=PA123&lpg=PA123&dq=%22Hanns+Hanfstaengl%22&source=bl&ots=Ze-5QVCx8r&sig=CrIacHmD3ekaaMF5nwh9SISZ77s&hl=en&ei=Es1ATL6KOOjtnQfl7PjtDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CC4Q6AEwCDgK#v=onepage&q=%22Hanns%20Hanfstaengl%22&f=false

same card type from 1878:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Heinrich_Haymerle.jpg

[HeikoGrusdat]

Timo..... next time only one photo per thread - gets confusing slowly.... :P

[Daniel Krause]

here it is:

[HeikoGrusdat]

Great job alltogether !!! :beer:

[Mike Dwyer]

First at all what period uniform it is? If it is pre WW1 (what I presume) then the EK2 must be 1870 issue.

Also what would be his rank? Major as well?

Second award is to plury I afraid to ID it.

Any help would be appreciated!

Timo aka Noor

Timo,

He isn't a Major, there's no fringe on his epaulettes. He has to be either a Leutnant, Oberleutnant, or Hauptmann/Rittmeister. He appears to be a Ulan officer. It's hard to tell, but I don't think there is a cypher or number on his epaulette, so he's probably from Garde-Ulan-Regt. 1, 2 or 3. They didn't have any cyphers or numbers on their epaulettes. I think, and I could be wrong, there is only one rank star on his epaulette which would make him an Oberleutnant.

Edited July 16, 2010 by Mike Dwyer

[HeikoGrusdat]

I think he is a Oberleutnant too.... 1 star on the board , if he stayed "at home" to make the photo the chance is good that he is from Garde-Ulanenregiment N°2 because that is the only one from Berlin directly - N°1 and N°3 were in Potsdam... the combination of medals and rank could probably solve the riddle and give him his name back - BUT - we need a date for that... a year on the reverse or anything like that... Just checked 1887 rank list (earliest I have) and that tells me that it may be possible with a exact year of the photo...without - not :(