Police Long Service Medal variations?

[Robin Lumsden]

Thanks Tony.

[Odin Mk 3]

The term 'unplated nickel silver' has been used to describe the first issues of this medal - I have always thought they were made of cupro-nickel.   Medal Year Book also states they were made of cupro-nickel. 

It is a shame they went away from the old card boxes of issue because they at least had a label which showed the force the man was serving in when his medal was issued.  Over the years I have acquired a few of the long extinct city and borough forces medals; I would have never known without the medals still being in their original boxes of issue. 

[bigjarofwasps]

What about the Latin wording? I've come across QEII D.G & QEII Br Omn, examples. What's the difference?

Edited May 25, 2015 by bigjarofwasps

[mariner]

Here's the translations of the various Latin you'll find on QE11's medals. I assume they equate to various times during her reign? But I may well be wrong there, so don't quote me.

Edited May 24, 2015 by mariner

[Odin Mk 3]

When QEII came to the throne most medals used the BR OMN REGINA F D inscription with the Queen's Head on the obverse (Korea Medal, GSM Malaya, NGS Malaya, Long Service Medals etc).  About 1955 the obverse inscription was changed to DEI GRATIA REGINA F D.  About the same time the medals which previously had the suspender pinned through the medal (eg NGS) were changed to the three point mounting system with three pins holding the suspender to the rim of the medal.  This change was made because the Royal Mint were told that the suspender should no longer obscure part of the medal obverse design. The Police LS Medal was always issued with the three point mounting system so both types of EIIR issues(and GVI issues) have the same suspender fixing arrangement.   

[bigjarofwasps]

Thanks Odin Mk3, so am I right in thinking that Police LSGC's with BR OMN REGINA F D, were awarded between 1952 & 1955,hence will be rarer that the DEI GRATIA version. Which I further assume is still being issued today (there must be thousands of this type, is it know how many of the earlier version were issued?). I also assume then that the earlier version would indicate that the Officer had served during the Second World War?

 

 

[Odin Mk 3]

Yes the BR OMN REGINA F D would be early QEII reign although I suspect the QEII head wasn't used until 1953 (crowned head) - so circa 1953-1955.

Many GVI issues were to men who served in WWII (usually qualifying for the Defence Medal) but some would have been awarded for men who qualified post May 1945 up to 1953 

Edited May 25, 2015 by Odin Mk 3

[bigjarofwasps]

Thanks again Odin. I've had a little surf of dealers lists and interestingly there appears to be no difference in pricing between the QEII D.G & QEII Br Omn, examples. Despite the latter appearing to be rarer? I've also noticed a difference between the naming styles on the various Police LSGC's. I wonder when this change occurred and is it possible to roughly workout a date difference in issuing by the naming styles?

[bigjarofwasps]

The Queen is set to become the longest ever reigning monarch in British history. On September 9 2015, she will pass the record set by her great-great-grandmother Queen Victoria. I wonder whether this will merit a change of design or wording?

[paul wood]

They are certainly introducing a new coinage head but in the next year or so but whether they will change the medal heads I do not know.

Paul

 

[bigjarofwasps]

They are certainly introducing a new coinage head but in the next year or so but whether they will change the medal heads I do not know.

Paul

 

​Will be interesting to see and certainly worthy of further discussion, perhaps I'll start a new thread?

[mariner]

I don't believe they will and my argument for this is based on the fact that the Golden Jubilee Medal (2002) has an older Elizabeth as the effigy, but the Iraq war medal (2003) for example has a young Elizabeth effigy. So I would imagine that the effigy will stay the same? HOWEVER Victoria did change the effigy on her medals for an older looking her, an example being the Boer War medal (1899-1901). So I may well be talking through my hat..........

[bigjarofwasps]

The New Ebola medal, certainly has an older Effigy on it. Could it be that they'll begin issuing all medals with this effigy from now one? Will LSGC medals be issued with this effigy in future?

[bigjarofwasps]

[dpk]

Hello All,

I have in my collection 3 different PLS&GC medal obverses- GVI crowned head "Britt Omn Rex Fid Def", QEII crowned head "D.G. Br. Omn" and QEII crowned head "Dei Gratia". I think that is the full set of obverse types but happy to learn more!

The GVI is cupro nickel, the QEII "D.G. Br. Omn' is cupro nickel, the QEII "Dei Gratia" is rhodium plated.

I think there may also be a QEII "Dei Gratia" in cupro nickel??

[bigjarofwasps]

On 24/04/2018 at 01:41, dpk said:

Hello All,

I have in my collection 3 different PLS&GC medal obverses- GVI crowned head "Britt Omn Rex Fid Def", QEII crowned head "D.G. Br. Omn" and QEII crowned head "Dei Gratia". I think that is the full set of obverse types but happy to learn more!

The GVI is cupro nickel, the QEII "D.G. Br. Omn' is cupro nickel, the QEII "Dei Gratia" is rhodium plated.

I think there may also be a QEII "Dei Gratia" in cupro nickel??

I think this one might be cupro nickel? I believe they were issued between 1955 and 2000? 

Edited February 10, 2019 by bigjarofwasps

[dpk]

Hi all- I have had a closer look at my obverses- in particular the QEII DEI GRATIA. The cupro-nickel Queens head is slightly more vertically placed on the disc than the Rhodium plated one. 

The rhodium plate head is tilted just a little towards the left- so that the cross on top of the rhodium crown point towards the end of the claw footing. The cupro-nickel cross points more towards the centre of claw fitting.

Amazing what you see when you really look closely!

[bigjarofwasps]

On 12/04/2019 at 03:41, dpk said:

Hi all- I have had a closer look at my obverses- in particular the QEII DEI GRATIA. The cupro-nickel Queens head is slightly more vertically placed on the disc than the Rhodium plated one. 

The rhodium plate head is tilted just a little towards the left- so that the cross on top of the rhodium crown point towards the end of the claw footing. The cupro-nickel cross points more towards the centre of claw fitting.

Amazing what you see when you really look closely!

Well observed! 
 

Would be interesting, if medals could be equally roughly dated by the styles of engraving used to name these medals over the years. The rhodium plating certainly proved very problematic.  

Although it maintains a nice shine, it doesn’t come without a cost, some examples of the faintness and chipping experienced due to the rhodium plating. 

[dpk]

Hi All,

I have what I believe are (almost) all of the variations in both the Special Constabulary Long Service Medal (1919) and the Police Long Service & Good Conduct Medal (1951) as shown below:

In the SC medals the obverses are- KGV crowned head from 1919 to 1931; KGV coinage head from 1931 to 1936; KGVI coinage head 'IND:IMP' from 1936 to 1949; KGVI coinage head 'FID.DEF' from 1949 to 1952; QEII coinage head 'BRIT.OMN' from 1952 to 1954; QEII coinage head 'DEI.GRATIA' from 1954 to date. All of these medals were made by the Royal Mint until about 1995 when the government, in a cost cutting measure, tendered out the manufacturing contract which was won by Birmingham Mint.

The last QEII medal pictured is a Birmingham Mint example- note the slightly softer look and the noticeable difference in the suspender compared to the earlier versions. The contract returned to the Royal Mint in 2007 and it is said their issues from that time were slightly less in quality than those they issued prior to 1995. It was announced in 2018 that the contract was to be awarded to Worcester Medals. I am not sure whether that did occur, and have not seen any medal said to have been made by them, or which I can identify as 'different' from the earlier types.

 

Re the Police LS & GC medals pictured, I believe they were all made by the Royal Mint although I have seen them offered on ebay occasionally with a Birmingham Mint case said to the original. I have not identified any differences in these medals, except for the metal content. The KGVI, and first 2 QEII versions were in nickel-silver and the last QEII is rhodium plated.

If anyone can advise on the later variations, or provide pics or even better offer one for sale, call me!!

 

DPK

[bigjarofwasps]

Something I’ve been pondering is will the new LSGC effigy, for C111R be crowned or uncrowned?
 

I’ve been informed that as of the 8th September the Royal Mint changed from E11R to C111R.

 

The first E11R LSGC’s were issued crowned, with no transitional period despite the fact the Queen wasn’t coronated until 15 months later?
 

Could we potentially see two versions of the C111R LSGC, or will they just remain uncrowned now like the RAF and RN LSGC’s? Or will they go straight for crowned like the first E11R?

 

 

[Dave Wilkinson]

I've read somewhere recently, that King Charles will not be depicted on medals or coins wearing a crown. There has been that much said about him of late that I can't recall where that was stated.

 

Dave.

[bigjarofwasps]

On 05/10/2022 at 15:01, Dave Wilkinson said:

I've read somewhere recently, that King Charles will not be depicted on medals or coins wearing a crown. There has been that much said about him of late that I can't recall where that was stated.

 

Dave.

A month on, and as far as I’m aware there have been no further announcements re medals. Although the Royal Mint, have begun striking new 50p pieces which it appears, will be in circulation next month. So assume it won’t be too much longer now on the medals front……….

[Megan]

The coinage head for King Charles III is uncrowned and set to remain so. Whether the same design will be used for medals will have to be seen.

[bigjarofwasps]

On 09/11/2022 at 19:10, Megan said:

The coinage head for King Charles III is uncrowned and set to remain so. Whether the same design will be used for medals will have to be seen.

Thought this might be of interest?

https://www.polfed.org/news/latest-news ... uct-medal/


Of particular interest is this paragraph…


“The Royal Mint is currently in the process of redesigning a number of medals to display the image of King Charles III which could lead to delay for those eligible for a bar.”

[bigjarofwasps]

Saw this on another internet platform, thought it might be of interest?

 

Figures from the Royal Mint annual reports that give an idea of how many Police LSGCs for UK orders were produced each year. Going through the various orders detailed in the online MINT series files might allow the figures to be extended to about 1991:

1952: 17,002 
1953: 4802 
1954: 3801 
1955: 7975 Combined figure for Police and Fire Brigade LSGCs
1956: 1500 
1957: 3318 
1958: 3451 Combined figure for Police and Fire Brigade LSGCs
1959: 4916 
1960: 2000 
1961: 2000 
1962: 2001 
1963: 1000 
1964: 0 
1965: Medal not listed - unclear if an oversight, or none produced
1966: Medal not listed - unclear if an oversight, or none produced
1967: 1045 
1968: 3268 
1969: 5050 
1970: 5484 
Q1 1971: 886 Reports change from covering calendar year to financial year (01 April-31 March)
1971-72: 3879 
1972-73: 4730 
1973-74: 2655 
1974-75: 4914 
1975-76: 2087 
1976-77: 3336

If the combined Police and Fire numbers for 1955 and 1958 are evenly split that makes roughly 85,000 medals from inception to early 1977. If the issue figure of, say, 3000 medals per year has continued in the 46 years since, that would make for another 138,000 Police LSGCs, almost all of which would be of the rhodium plated variety.