Komtur Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 For some years I have a medal bar with matching miniature chain in my collection, belonging to a greek officer from the early 20th century. I wonder, if there is a way to attribute this bar to a single person. Are there sources to be found, like greek order lists or rank lists? Any help is appreciated! Komtur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldstream Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 Komtur, Sadly I know nothing about Greek Medals but just wanted to comment on what appears to me to be a nice looking bar and miniature group. Very Germanic looking to my eyes and very well presented. Regards Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul C Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 If you could get an approximate date of when the PCO was awarded to the officer then a look through the Ordens Almanac should turn up some prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 I think Serbian White Eagle Order was made by G. A. Scheid. Looks like 2nd type (year 1882 on reverse) which would put in a 1904-1914 period. I'll try to find Greek recipients in the Official Gazette and newspapers from that era, maybe we'll get lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, Paul C said: If you could get an approximate date of when the PCO was awarded to the officer then a look through the Ordens Almanac should turn up some prospects. Thanks Paul, but I don´t think that will work. The Ordens Almanach (latest edition 1908/9) mostly listed German recipients. Additionaly it is more likely, that the Crown Order is of later date. The Greek medals are for the wars against Turkey 1912/13 and Bulgaria 1913 Edited September 3, 2017 by Komtur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 4 hours ago, paja said: I think Serbian White Eagle Order was made by G. A. Scheid. Looks like 2nd type (year 1882 on reverse) which would put in a 1904-1914 period. I'll try to find Greek recipients in the Official Gazette and newspapers from that era, maybe we'll get lucky. You are right (See picture of reverse). There must be a relation to King Konstantin I. of Greece, who was married with Sophie of Prussia, a sister of Wilhelm II, in 1889. Konstantin became king in 1913, unfortunately there is a long period of possible occasions for exchanging decorations, like reciprocal family visits. It would be very kind, if you could look for Greek military recipients of the Serbian White Eagle Order. In between I will look for these persons with a Crown Order 3rd class in the Prussian Order Lists, to double check your findings. BTW the medal bar was arranged by the German company J. Godet & Sohn, Berlin. Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 So far I wasn't able to find a single Greek recipient, unfortunately. If something pops up I'l let you know immediately. Best of luck with the further research! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 5, 2017 Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 7 hours ago, paja said: So far I wasn't able to find a single Greek recipient, unfortunately. If something pops up I'l let you know immediately. ... Many thanks for trying! I am still working on the Greek recipients of the 3rd class of the Prussian Crown Order. As far, as I can estimate, there will be about 30 candidates. Therefore I need another source to fix it to one person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Igor Ostapenko Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 On 3 בספטמבר 2017 at 10:20, Komtur said: For some years I have a medal bar with matching miniature chain in my collection, belonging to a greek officer from the early 20th century. I wonder, if there is a way to attribute this bar to a single person. Are there sources to be found, like greek order lists or rank lists? Any help is appreciated! Komtur. Great medalsbar !!! Order for Bravery - early Zimmermann production ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 8, 2017 Author Share Posted September 8, 2017 (edited) From 1903 on I found these Greek officers as recipients of the 3rd class Prussian Crown Order: 15.4.1904 Polyzòys, Kgl. griech. Korvettenkapitän 12.4.1905 Orphanidis, Kgl. griech. Hautpm. und Adjutant 12.4.1905 Valvis, Kgl. griech. Hauptm., Adjutant des Chefs der Gendarmerie 12.4.1905 Zymbrakakis, Kgl. griech. Hauptm. der Gendarmerie 12.4.1905 Spyracos, Kgl. griech. Hauptm. der Inf. 12.4.1905 Negrepontis, Kgl. griech. Hauptm. der Ingenieure 12.4.1905 Bouboulis, Kgl. griech. Kapitänleutnant 12.4.1905 Zochios, Kgl. griech. Kapitänleutnant 15.9.1905 Hatzanestis, Kgl. griech. Hautpmann im Generalstabe 27.4.1908 Troupaki, Nikola, Kgl. griech. Hauptm. In der Gendarmerie 27.4.1908 Bellini, Nikolas, Kgl. griech. Kapitänleutnant 27.4.1908 Paparigopoulo, Etienne, Kgl. griech. Kapitänleutnant 27.4.1908 Andreadis, Anastasios, Kgl. griech. Kapitänleutnant 3.5.1909 Levidis, Constantin, Kgl. griech. Hauptm. der Art., Flügeladjut. des Kronprinzen 3.5.1909 Skouffos, Georges, Kgl. griech. Hauptm. vom Genie, Adjut. des Kronprinzen 24.4.1911 Mantzagriotakis Jatrou, Constantin, Kgl. griech. Gend. Major Polizeidirektor in Corfu 2.5.1912 Metaxas, Johann, Kgl. griech. Hauptm., Adjut. des Kriegsministers 3.9.1913 Krièzi, A. Kgl. griech. Kapitänleutnant 10.9.1914 Saliotis, Kgl. griech. Hauptmann im Kriegsministerium 13.11.1914 Lévidis, N. Kgl. griech. Major der Kavallerie The red marked persons IMHO would be suspects for a Godet-mounted bar made in Berlin. Captain Johann Metaxas was in May 1913 responsible for the military convention between Greece and Serbia. This could be a reason for receiving a Serbian decoration. Besides this he had a close relation to Crown Prince Constantine and especially to his wife Princess Sophie of Prussia. Edited September 9, 2017 by Komtur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 9, 2017 Author Share Posted September 9, 2017 On 7.9.2017 at 07:26, Igor Ostapenko said: ... Order for Bravery - early Zimmermann production ! Lieutenant Colonel Johann Metaxas got this cross in the gold version according to a biografie of him in September 1914. Metaxas was at this time Chief of Operations at GHQ and the closest ally to King Constantine I. and the center figure of the Greek royalist party. BTW the king wore his medal bar at this time also in German Style So Metaxas seems to be a quite hot candidate for my medal bar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 (edited) In between I got the hint of the Greek Wikipedia biografie of Ioannis Metaxas. In the second part of his biographie about his military career there is mentioned, that he got in 1913 that order! Until now I can verify five of seven decoration on this bar for Metaxas (position 1, 2, 4, 5, 6). On 5.9.2017 at 15:58, paja said: So far I wasn't able to find a single Greek recipient, unfortunately. If something pops up I'l let you know immediately. Best of luck with the further research! Because of his activities for the military convention with Serbia I assume, Metaxas could have gotten a Serbian order after May 1913, when this convention was signed. Could this information be of use, to search again in your sources for a possible award of the Serbian White Eagle Order to Major or Lieutenant-Colonel Metaxas? Many thanks in advance! Edited September 12, 2017 by Komtur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 (edited) Digging up recipients of the Serbian decorations, especially foreign ones, is very problematic. First of all, records kept at the Chancellery of Orders were destroyed during WW2. There's the Official Military Gazette, but unfortunately not all numbers are available online, over ten years are missing and some years are incomplete. Apart from that, generally speaking, names of the foreign recipients were not being published in the Gazette. There are Schematisms but only for the XIX century and only for the Serbian citizens who were among the living at the time. They are not available online and very hard to find, practically only a few libraries in Serbia have them in possession. Main source I used for digging up some foreign recipients were newspapers from that era, unfortunately, so far that was a dead end. Once I catch some free time, I'll check every name from the list you published. Earliest records of Metaxas' name in the Serbian press are from 1915. Edited September 13, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 14, 2017 Author Share Posted September 14, 2017 Thanks for that substantial comment to the available sources about recipients of Serbian decorations. So we are missing Serbian periodicals, like staats almanacs, court calendars or order lists. So it seems to be really hard to find especially foreign persons among the recipients. In the past I often successfull researched medal bars or decorated persons on portrait fotographs of my own collection and for other collectors too. Therefore I know the expenditure of time one need for this kind of work. Thats the reason I really appreciate your help . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted September 14, 2017 Share Posted September 14, 2017 Don't mention it, I was really hoping I would find something. So far the only Greek recipient of the White Eagle I stumbled upon in the press is foreign minister Politis (1918), that's it. Unfortunately most of the names from the list have zero search results... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komtur Posted September 21, 2017 Author Share Posted September 21, 2017 On 7.9.2017 at 07:26, Igor Ostapenko said: Great medalsbar !!! Order for Bravery - early Zimmermann production ! Could you please tell me, how to recognize a Zimmermann made cross and what time of farbrication exactly means early? Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now