EK 1870 My 1870 Iron Cross 2nd Class

[Hauptmann]

Hi all,

Okay, this is "the" post I've dreaded... even though I have no reason to suspect any problems with this I know I generally have the Bundy luck (if you have seen Married With Children... you'll know what I mean) and I'm just terrified of hearing anything but good things on this... at least as to originality.

I've compared this to God only knows how many pics of what were supposed to be real ones and I can't see any difference.

I've done the magnet test and it passes. The core is iron. There are no maker or silver marks or marks of any kind that I can find on the frame or the ring. The ring is solid... no sign of a join. And the frame does indeed appear to be silver and is the standard type used on IC 2nd's.

Now before anyone jumps in on the ribbon... no, it's not original to the piece! I have the original... or at least what originally came with it. It's not in the greatest of shape so it's safely stored away. The non-combattant on it was originally in much better shape but somehow it's become tattered at the end like this over the years. But I put it on to make it stand out so it couldn't be accidently confused with a standard WWI of which I used to have about twenty.

So just disregard the ribbon. I probably should have just taken the pics with it off but I was in a bit of a rush to get all my pics done so it just ended up being left on.

Also, please excuse the lack of scanner quality photos. I am planning to get one but for now I'm stuck with a digital camera which considering has been doing a pretty good job with all that I've posted so far.

Okay, now that the apologies are over... here go the pics. Keep in mind I'll be on my knees wearing out the carpet praying for the blessings of all the expert members that this is A-Okay, no problems, nice piece, etc. Pleeeeeeaaaase don't let my prayers be in vain!

Okay... really, here goes...

No... really, right now...

Okay, okay, I've stalled enough... now for sure:

I've even shown this one to Jack Angolia... he saw nothing wrong with it but admitted he's far from being an expert in Imperial... his specialty having been WWII items.

Alot of folks have seen it... none have ever had any problems. But none have been as expert as the members of this club. But I figure if ya'll give it a good, clean bill of health then I can finally and completely sleep the sleep of the dead at night, at least on this subject.

And keep in mind I obtained this in a trade over twenty years ago. I do not have a ton in it. I am not going to jump off a cliff "if" God forbid there is a problem. I may start to seriously mumble to myself incoherently and have to be put into a home... but that's beside the point.

Point is... I need to know for once and for all, for sure, absolutely positive so I can stop this nagging doubt in my head that seems to pervade all German militaria these days.

Okay... enough lunatic raving... oh wait... saving that type for after the results are in... depending on the results... I leave it to you oh wise judges of all that is good and all that is not.

Pleaseeeeeeeee be merciful with me! I beg thee!

Thanks,

Dan

... prayers starting.............. now!

[Biro]

No problems here - looks perfectly good award type to me.. rather straight arms, but I wouldn't get too hung up on that.

Congratulations.

And it would look better with the original ribbon, whatever its condition...

Marshall

Edited April 13, 2006 by Biro

[Hauptmann]

No problems here - looks perfectly good award type to me.. rather straight arms, but I wouldn't get too hung up on that.

Congratulations.

And it would look better with the original ribbon, whatever its condition...

Marshall

Hi Marshall,

Well, that's one! Probably when I get up to five or six I'll then start the celebrations! But the old ticker is feeling like... no heart attack tonight... definitely a good thing!

Seriously thanks so much. I'm beginning to feel much more at ease. As I say I've had this one forever and a day. I've actually had a ton of offers, but I've always wanted to hang onto it.

I'll never forget a story I heard before I got mine. There was a militaria club meeting down in Tampa or St. Petersburg Florida, can't remember which. Meeting was running late and everyone was at a point where they were sitting at a table and tossing out stuff for sale or trade. One young man... probably early 20's who was a visitor... had never been there before, tossed in an IC 2nd.

Several folks gave it a cursory glance but in those days they were so common and cheap that interest was not high. There didn't seem to be anything special about it... just a common, ordinary IC 2nd from WWI. Finally one gent asked what he was asking. $25 was the reply. Seemed a bit on the high side but he decided to go for it.

So the meeting finally started to break up. Everyone took off. Only a few of the old time core members were left, including the one who had purchased the IC. He'd just stuck it in his pocket. But he decided to take it out and look at it again.

You've probably guessed by now. It turns out it was an 1870 sans the 25 year device. No one, including the buyer had thought to turn it over to check on the date... probably because of it's being so inexpensive.

Well, he asked around about who the young man was as he did not want to take advantage of him and wanted to offer it back to him for the same price. No one knew him, they couldn't locate him and he never showed up again.

No idea if this is true or not... but it's what I was told many many moons ago.

I heard that and just knew I "had" to have one of those "legendary" 1870 IC's no matter what.

As I say I got this one in trade. Was at a reputable militaria dealers in Tampa at the time. A friend of the owner came in to meet me as I had some things he was intro'd in. Basically I had three cased Italian Orders of the Crown in various degrees... I think it was like a couple of the ones that hung on ribbons on the chest, one with the rossette and one without and one of the neck orders. He had several pieces that interested me including the 1870 and the owner gave his opinion that everything was fine both ways. We came to an agreement and made the trade and I've had this ever since.

I do hope to someday obtain the 25 year oaks but even if I don't at least I have my very own 1870.

Can't thank you enough for getting the ball rolling on this. If nothing else I think I'll sleep better tonight than I have in a long time as this has just been nagging away in the back of my mind forever and a day. I always seem to see the black cloud in every silver lining so glad that it seems as if the Bundy luck has passed over me this day.

Thanks again,

Dan

[Stogieman]

Concur on this. absolutely original cross in fine condition.

[Hauptmann]

Concur on this. absolutely original cross in fine condition.

Hi Stogieman,

Oh you don't know how I longed to here more people in the know say this! I feel so much joy right now you just can't imagine. I've always believed in it on most levels but again there was always this nagging doubt brought along by all the problems with German items and especially rare and expensive ones having been duped to death. As well as my usual Bundy luck. Looks like this time the Bundy black cloud has passed me by! And I could not be happier!

Thank you sooooooo much!

Just out of curiosity as I'd never want to part with it but would pass it down... any idea on rough value? Just a ballpark would do. Also on the Griffin I posted if you happen to know. Thanks!

Dan

[gregM]

It's a good one

[Hauptmann]

Hey guys... you have all warmed my heart and set my mind at ease.

I just can't say enough how grateful I am to you all for confirming what I always felt in my heart but needed sooooo badly to hear.

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!

Dan

[Daniel Murphy]

Dan ,

You have a very nice piece there, I also think the original ribbon should be put back on it. Somehow, an older one like that does not look right with a mint ribbon. I once asked someone in jest if there was a 12 step program for militaria addiction. If there was I would refer you.

Dan Murphy

Edited April 14, 2006 by Daniel Murphy

[Hauptmann]

Dan ,

You have a very nice piece there, I also think the original ribbon should be put back on it. Somehow, an older one like that does not look right with a mint ribbon. I once asked someone in jest if there was a 12 step program for militaria addiction. If there was I would refer you.

Dan Murphy

Hi Dan,

I'll take that as high praise! :-) You name it I've grabbed it. I'm a... "Hey, I like that... oh it's cheap too... I'll grab it." kind of a guy. I'd just be far, far too bored being a specialist. I'm the same with all my hobbies which are many... at least my wife thinks so. Hey, keeps me off the streets... at least when I'm not metal detecting near them.

If nothing else I may just find an older piece of ribbon in better shape and put on it. The original was just falling apart. Be afraid to use it and do yet more damage. Shame of it is that I just got a very kind donation of one from Tom Young along with an Italian button he was giving away. He sent the ribbon so I could finally provide one for an WWI IC 2nd that our museum has on display. The IC was a donation from a local WWI vet and his family many, many moons ago... but sadly it had no ribbon. So now it will. I used to have spares but most of my extra ribbon stock went out years ago. Didn't want to let them go... long story but it had to happen. I actually need to build back up. I have several KC ribbons along with a good deal of Eastern Front and Luftschutz left along with a few odds and ends.

But definitely, once I get another one I'd be happy to pop it on. She is a very nice piece and I agree that she'll display much nicer with an original ribbon.

Thanks,

Dan

[byf]

Very nice cross. I should put an 1870 on my list.

byf

[Hauptmann]

Hi all,

I decided that since I now have a scanner I'd go ahead and redo pics of select "important" items... my 1870 being one of them. I'm hoping that perhaps with better and more detailed shots that maybe by some slim chance we might be able to positively nail down a maker. And if nothing else that ya'll might enjoy seeing her in a bit more of her glory.

So without further ado... here she is. If anyone wants to request any other shots please let me know and I'll do my best to get what you need.

I'm going to do one side at a time going from a full shot to the details.

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Dan

[DavidM]

Hello

I can sympathise with those nagging doubts. So, after much carefull consideration I've decided to help you out. Simply post that EK to me and you won't have to worry over it ever again !!

Seriously Dan, as you've been told already, it's a good one - and a nice one as well

Edited October 3, 2006 by DavidM

[Hauptmann]

Hello

I can sympathise with those nagging doubts. So, after much carefull consideration I've decided to help you out. Simply post that EK to me and you won't have to worry over it ever again !!

Seriously Dan, as you've been told already, it's a good one - and a nice one as well

Hi David,

Sorry for any confusion... I'd actually just reposted the pics because my originals were not the greatest... they were taken with my digital camera. So now that I have my scanner I've had a few select items including this one that I wanted to do scans and post them to show more details... in this case more for enjoyment and possibly anyone who wanted to see more details.

Believe me, when I got the thumbs up on my original posts that was good enough for me. But I'm always happy for more confirmation so I do deeply appreciate your additional confirmation. In such instances more is always better.

And many thanks for your compliment. She's a pretty old girl and I love her more today than I did when I got her.

Thanks much,

Dan